[MD] On Time?

[ian glendinning]

Scott, Case,

Scott's been quizzing me in another thread on my physicalist view that
conciousness is just a part of nature like any other, rather than
something pre-existing independently. In this thread you exchanged
this ... with my interjections [IG]

Case: Are there discrete levels of consciousness?

Scott: I doubt it. Levels of rules, yes, though how 'discrete' they are is open
to question. Nor is it clear which levels are ontologically prior to others.

[IG] Levels yes. Discrete no, not really, only by convention. (You
managed to debate iron filings, amoebas and humans, and I'm sure you
meant different things by consciousness, intellect, awareness, etc.)

Case: If consciousness exists in its own special realm why does it need to
bother with ours?

Scott: Consciousness creates all realms, so I don't know what you mean by a
special one.

[IG] As case asked earlier I'd have to ask where you get any evidence
of that from Scott (not proof either way, just evidence, signs,
whatever) Since I already believe in physics in everyday life (I don't
drown when I drink a cup of tea for example) I suspend disbelief that
physics will actually explain the whole of nature. Why wouldn't I ? In
fact, I'd go further and cite increasing evidence that something like
quality, interactions, differences, information, communications even,
seem to underly all physics, inlcuding much "mind functioning" or
anything claiming any level of consciuousness or intellect - evidence
not proof - so I suspend disbelief - I don't go grapsing for a
supernatural explanation - an explanation beyond nature - Why ?

Scott:
Now a question for you. From your viewpoint, why is there awareness? Why
couldn't whatever it is that happens be happening without awareness?

[IG] This you will recognise, given our other thread, as Chalmers hard
problem - the subjective aspect of consciousness. Clearly some forms
of consciousness, are unaware with no apparent first person "view".
Why awareness ? is simple, because it evolved as being something
better than being conscious without it (I don't buy Chalmers' Zombie
remember). Clearly many forms of consciousness can be independant of
brains too. But what we're doing now is spreading out consciousness
across many levels, and we'll need to define some sub-sets to make
much sense. Clearly one kind of consciousness (just one) is the first
person awareness experience.

Ian