[MD] The Sophists as the Last Philosophical Mystics

[skutvik at online.no]

On 27 Dec 2005 at 15:14, MarshaV wrote:

> At 01:33 PM 12/27/2005, Bo wrote:
> >ZMM's Romantic/Classic divide confers to LILA's
> >Social/Intellectual one, it's plain as the day. The former appeared
> >as Quality itself tp Pheadrus because it was (still is) non-dualist
 
> Hi Bo,
 
> I've never thought of the Romantic/Classical split being the same as
> the Social/Intellectual Levels.  

Great to speak to you Marsha.
Also great to be the sole contributor these days as one is actually 
read. ;-) The Romantic/Classic=Social/Intellect is a fall-out from 
the SOL interpretation that had its origin in the diagram in ZMM 
(page 243 Corgi Paperback) of the first "moq". Here the Classic 
half is subtitled "intellectual" which divides into subjective (mind) 
and objective (matter). 

> And while there may be aspects of the
> Romantic side that are less static, I've never thought of it as
> representing Dynamic Quality.  Where is your interpretation coming
> from???

The crucial point is the box-diagrams that mislead us into 
believing that there is a Quality left behind after the R/C split is 
made, but that is not so, it's Quality itself which is split this way!. 
Thus the Romantic half contains Quality's dynamic aspect and 
Classic half contains its static aspect. And as ZMM clearly 
describes the transition from a Quality-reality to a Quality-devoid 
S/O-reality it's as clear that (in a level context)  this must be the 
social-intellectual shift.  

I may be so immersed in this that I fail to see that it is not as 
obvious to others, but - again - the source of all "ills" is the notion 
of a DQ outside everything. The MOQ is the DQ/SQ split, full 
stop! Paul Turner tried for a long time to keep up the same 
diagram-induced illusion regarding the MOQ proper, of a DQ 
after the DQ/SQ split, but Pirsig's information that ZMM's Aretê is 
what got DQ/SQ split in LILA confirms my assertion.  

Thanks for the interest.

Bo


PS.
In a ridiculous short sentence ...

"The former appeared as Quality itself tp Pheadrus because it 
was (still is) non-dualist"

.... I made short thrift of the huge question why Pirsig identified 
ancient Aretê with his own Quality, but I still think intellect's S/O-
dualism is the culprit. It is inherently "ugly", at least in its role as a 
"metaphysics" - as SOM, but as a static level of the MOQ it is 
perfectly right.

Yours.