[MD] MoQ as religion [Belief Defininition]

[David Harding]

Hi SA,

David said:
>>In regards to a definition of belief.  I have read
>>Pirsig say it doesn't exist.  Personally I think
>>it's best seen as a hypothesis or prediction which
>>hasn't yet been tested.

SA said:
>      definition of belief?  I agree this is in
> question, because belief is belief, not something as
> solid or static as say - a tree.  I like your
> definition.  Belief itself, to me, is oh, let's say
> 25% static and 75% dynamic, thus, very hard to define
> without having a lot undefined amidst its' definition.
>  Tree on the other hand is let's say 75% static and
> 25% dynamic, thus, has more definition to it.  Of
> course these numbers are used to just get a point
> across.  Therefore I like your definition given above.
> 
> 
>>For Quality however, no 'belief' is necesssary, it's
>>already there in front of you. The Zen line is "Can
>>you see?".
> 
> 
>      Yes, I see (SQ), and I don't see (DQ).  

I think everyone sees both DQ and SQ, they just don't know it.  SQ is easier to see than DQ because that's what we expect, the usual. But the unusual happens all the time, it's just that after many 
years of living our patterns can seem to think they know everything.  Meditation is a practice where we train ourselves to expect the unexpected simply by putting our patterns and habits to sleep. 
Sitting meditation is, as Pirsig has pointed out, a carefully contrived situation where nothing much is happening at all and after a while you actually get good at just sitting there and the mind 
naturally, of its own accord, winds down like a clock.  It's at this point enlightenment is said to occur and nothing is left but pure Dynamic Quality.

Do we
> ever get full SQ (something totally defined)? no; Do
> we ever get full DQ (something totally undefined)? no

Your definition of Dynamic Quality troubles me.  DQ is not *something* totally undefined. Dynamic Quality is nothing.  Also, I don't think that Quality is something for us to 'get'. Who or what does 
the recieving if quality is not there to begin with?

> I'll always notice, even beyond the pointing finger,
> one or the other out of the corner of my eye.
> 
> What do you think?

Read above.

> 
> Thanks,
> SA
> 
> P.S. For some reason, this posting of yours did not go
> through in the MOQ.org archives.  The title is in the
> archives, but not the message itself that you typed. 
> Therefore I had to go into my yahoo inbox to retrieve
> this message from you.  I don't know what happened.
> 

Me either.

Cheers,

David.