[MD] Distinguishing Levels

[Heather Perella]

Platt,

     SA said:  "Platt I'm trying to work with you on
this
> > discussion in a hope that I can understand where
> you are coming from.  When you say inorganic level
> > activity is predictable, I question that.  When
> > elements bond, for instance in the earth's mantle,
> can we really predict what these elements will
become
> with such a wild mix of elements everywhere bonding,
> > breaking up, and bonding again to some day come up
> > through a volcano that is not predictable as to
> what
> > the mixture of that future volcano will erupt. 
> > Volcano's erupt different elements on the
> inorganic
> > level from place to place who knows what the next
> > volcano coming up from the sea floor or land will
> be. 
> > The magma mixture in the mantle is very dynamic
> that
> > what is there now, may not be there later."

     Platt responded:  "I presume the various mixtures
of elements that a
> volcano might produce will
> not in any way change the table of basic elements,
> nor will a different 
> heap of such elements constitute any sort of
> evolutionary step
> forward." 

     Platt you are talking about elements, but there
mixture and bonding is still inorganic and that is
unpredictable.  Whatever kind of mixture or bonding
these elements involve themselves with coming from the
mantle to the earth's surface as lava will definitely
have a play in what kind of soil that part of the
earth will have.  What will that soil, inorganic
level, be?  Oh, and if it rains a lot or is very dry
that will also play a hand in what kind of inorganic
level will be present.  So many factors are involved.
 
     SA said:  "Also, on the biological level, what
will my son
> > look like going through the developmental stages
> in
> > the womb and out of the womb when that day comes? 
> I
> > have no idea, and the sequences of DNA are not on
> a
> > steady pattern of this is what the boy will look
> like
> > and let's get there kind of attitude.  The
> environment
> > influences brain develop and bodily development
> (food,
> > water, sound, etc...)  I don't believe that there
> is
> > an archetype or an ideal boy, flower, etc...  Why
> do
> > flowers growing in a field with seemingly the same
> > parents and environment grow with diversity?  So
> many
> > factors are involved and this diversity is right
> down
> > DQ's path.  I am having a hard time understanding
> your
> > predictable, seemingly archetype or set pattern
> where
> > everything has this ideal way of being with no
> > individual mixture of freedom that something could
> > quite possibly become where I'm pretty sure the
> flower
> > and DNA have no idea what they will become, as
> they
> > depend on the amount of sunlight, rain, all these
> > unpredictable factors.
> >      If, you can, please clear this up."


     Platt said:  "The fact that scientists are now
beginning to
> manipulate and control 
> DNA patterns indicates to me that it won't be long
> before you can order 
> up exactly the baby you want as to looks, hair
> color, skin 
> pigmentation, etc. not to mention sex."

     First off, we'll see as to how much control we
will have on what our babies will look like.  'A cure
for cancer will be here very soon' has been a slogan
I've heard since the 1980's.  Yet, not to go off
track, I'm not sure what this manipulation by humans
has to do with "What will my son look like?"
 
     Platt said:  "In the horticulture field 
> scientist have long been able to manipulate and
> control breeding so 
> that various new types of wheat, for example, have
> been developed to 
> resist diseases.  My point is that the mechanisms by
> which variety in 
> biological forms are produced are known."

     Platt, scientists are very, very far off from
knowing exactly how to produce round noses versus
pointed noses and to have these combined with long
legs, well, this is all just talk.  The field of
evolutionary development where the understandings that
go on inside of womb is a new, young field.  I know
Gould in his book, "The Structure of Evolutionary
Theory" from ca. the year 2000 was calling on people
to practice in this field he called so open and
unknown.  How anything inside the womb actually gets
from here to there even in a weeks time is terra
incognito, or in other words, a field in science that
still has much to reveal for we just don't know. 
There are some scientists that know that certain
markers go on and off and when this happens certain
genes are triggered and it is the sequence of genes
that are triggered that develops a wing of a fruit fly
either on the back or coming out of the head of this
creature.  Yet, the why the triggering happens when it
does, and how that triggering is triggered and to even
know what genes are.  Sure the human DNA is being
mapped, but what those genes do on the map - well
nobody knows.


     Platt said:  "By contrast, the formula for 
> a successful metaphysics escapes the most dedicated
> practitioner of 
> intellect."

     I doubt this statement as well, because the
metaphysics of cosmology became what is now astronomy.
 Thus, a metaphysics that changed into a science, even
as Natural Philosophy became known more as a Natural
Science in the 1800's due to data streaming in more
and more according to an orientation that matched
theories in a way that mirrored the by then well
established science known as physics.
 
     Platt said:  "In sum, the ability of inorganic
and biological
> forces to produce 
> unpredictable surface results (like the weather)
> does not in any way  
> change the understanding and predictability of the
> forces themselves."

     I never thought of this one, but you pointed out
another unpredictable chaos, inorganic, and biological
level force known as the weather.  Even now-a-days,
society and thus, intellect is being blamed at times
for influencing the weather.  What is the weather or
the forces in the weather made up of?  All these
levels on a very unpredictable scale. 
 
     Platt said:  "But the forces that change a
society are neither
> understood nor 
> predictable (except in Pirsig's thesis a general but
> undefined move 
> towards betterness) and individual thoughts are
> likewise beyond any 
> certainty whatsoever. I have no idea what thoughts
> my brain will 
> generate in the next two minutes, or what
> revolutionary idea I will 
> come up with tomorrow that will change the world."

     You could plan ahead and come up with an idea as
to what you could do tomorrow or next year for that
matter.
 
Thanks,
SA

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