[MD] Distinguishing Levels

[Platt Holden]

> [Platt]
> Because you claimed you can take a picture of a society by taking  a
> picture of a city. Ridiculous. You can't show a social pattern by
> showing a picture of an altar or a judge's bench. Pirsig defines social
> patterns::
> 
> "In Lila there is a difference, although I neglected to state it. Cells
> are objective.  Societies are subjective. No objective scientific
> instrument can detect a society."
> 
> When your camera produces a photograph of the subjective, let me know.
> 
> [Arlo]
> Okay, Platt. I think you're just baiting me here. But in the off-chance
> you're actually serious in thinking you "caught me" in something, I'll
> take you through it in three easy steps. Ready?
> 
> 1. I KNOW cameras can't capture subjective social patterns.
> 
> With me?

Good. So why did you claim a picture of a city captured social 
patterns?

> 2. YOU claimed a picture of an ant colony was PROOF ants aren't social.
 
No. I said a picture of an ant colony that you CLAIM is a social 
pattern shows no such pattern. But it does show a biological pattern -- 
an ant colony.

> You see? If a picture of an ant colony PROVES ants aren't on the social
> level, then a picture of my HOG group would PROVE humans aren't social. 

You see? A picture of your HOG group shows no social pattern. All it 
shows is biological patterns -- human bodies. You have to EXPLAIN to me 
that it is a social pattern. No one has to explain what an ant colony 
is because you can show it in a picture. 

> The point is, a picture of an ant colony IS NOT proof that ants don't
> belong on the social level. Nor would a picture of a group of primates
> be PROOF that primates aren't social. No camera in the world could
> capture primate social patterns, and so you can't claim that by taking a
> picture of a group of primates you have proof they aren't social.

When you can take a picture of subjective social pattern without 
explaining that it's a social pattern, let me know. If I could, I would 
test your theory by attaching  a picture of a dozen people and ask you 
to identify what group they represented without giving you any hints. 
You couldn't do it.  Why? Because you can't photograph a social 
pattern. 

Get it?

Platt    





> 
> Arlo
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