[MD] Distinguishing Levels

[Arlo J. Bensinger]

Platt,

Either you're deliberately being obtuse, or you're just baiting. Ah, what the
hell, I'll bite...

[Arlo previously]
1. I KNOW cameras can't capture subjective social patterns.

With me?

[Platt]
Good. So why did you claim a picture of a city captured social patterns?

[Arlo]
No, I claimed that if a picture of an ant colony was proof that ants aren't
social, then a picture of a HOG group proves people aren't social.

[Arlo previously]
2. YOU claimed a picture of an ant colony was PROOF ants aren't social.

[Platt] 
No. I said a picture of an ant colony that you CLAIM is a social pattern shows
no such pattern. But it does show a biological pattern --  an ant colony.

[Arlo]
If a picture is incapable of capturing any social patterns, then how is a
picture PROOF that social patterns in ants don't exist?

And, "an ant colony is a biological pattern"? Really? So an "ant colony" is just
a giant "cell"? Or a "single, biological individual"?

[Arlo previously]
You see? If a picture of an ant colony PROVES ants aren't on the social level,
then a picture of my HOG group would PROVE humans aren't social. 

[Platt] 
You see? A picture of your HOG group shows no social pattern. All it  shows is
biological patterns -- human bodies. You have to EXPLAIN to me  that it is a
social pattern. No one has to explain what an ant colony is because you can
show it in a picture. 

[Arlo]
So, a camera is incapable of capturing social patterns, but can be used to prove
social patterns don't exist in ants. This makes no sense.

A picture of an "ant colony" is simply a picture of individual, biological ants.
Just as a picture of my HOG group is a picture of individual, biological
humans.

[Platt]
When you can take a picture of subjective social pattern without  explaining
that it's a social pattern, let me know. If I could, I would  test your theory
by attaching  a picture of a dozen people and ask you to identify what group
they represented without giving you any hints. You couldn't do it.  Why?
Because you can't photograph a social pattern.

[Arlo]
No you can't. Not in ants, and not in people.

And, why the "no hints" clause? If I took my picture of my HOG group around,
everyone I showed it too would say, "it's a motorcycle group, and this guy here
is the president, and that's his mate" and they could likely figure out as much
about the social relations as you could figure out about which ants interact
with which other ants, and who does what work, and etc.

[Platt]
Get it?

[Arlo]
Oh, I get it all right.

Arlo