[MD] Emergent Consciousness

[ian glendinning]

Einstein or not, "consciousness as illusion" is a very popular concept.

Blackmore and Dennett use this view and Daniel Wegner's book (I
reviewed recently) "The Illusion of Consciousness" makes no bones
about it.

I say consiciousness is an illusion, only in the sense that it's not
quite what we (traditionally) think it is, in exactly the same way
that I is itself an "illusion".

Highly abstract, emergent, intangible, many layers above the physical.
But it's real enough.
Ian

On 6/20/06, Arlo J. Bensinger <ajb102 at psu.edu> wrote:
> [SA to Ham]
> Arlo said:  "Like I've said, I consider the "I" and the "collective
> consciousness" to be co-constructs at the social level, siding with Einstein's
> view that the "I" is an "optical delusion of consciousness"
>
> [Ham]
> Albert Einstein did not define the 'I' of consciousness as "an optical
> delusion,"...
>
> then Ham quotes from Einstein...
>
> "We experience ourselves, our thoughts and feelings as something separate from
> the rest.  A kind of optical delusion of consciousness."
>
> [Arlo]
> Yes, apparently he did define the I as "an optical delusion of consciousness".
> Unless it is the "kind of" which is your "latch onto to prove Arlo wrong",
> which I'll cede. So, Einstein considered the "I" "a kind of optical delusion of
> consciousness." I agree.
>
> Then Ham quotes the Einstein passages at length, but a quick perusal of the
> archives will show that Arlo has included both of these, in their full
> resplendid glory as Ham presents them, many times in the past. Why Ham thinks
> showing these full quotes is an "A Ha!" is beyond me, but I welcome their
> inclusion (again) in the dialogue.
>
> [Ham]
> If we're going to infer support for the MoQ from what others believe, the least
> we can do is quote them accurately and in the context of their overall
> statement.
>
> [Arlo]
> Certainly, Ham. I welcome the full context of Einstein's quotes. They support
> only better what I've already said.
>
> Arlo
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