[MD] Bill's Intellectual Level

[Arlo Bensinger]

[Plattman]
Honor is about truth and honesty. It's intellectual, as Pirsig makes clear:

"Truth is an intellectual pattern of values. Is science unconcerned? A 
scientist may argue rationally that the moral question, "Is it all right to 
murder your neighbor?" is not a scientific question. But can he argue that 
the moral question, "Is it all right to fake your scientific data?" is not 
a scientific question? Can he say, as a scientist, "The faking of 
scientific data is no concern of science?"

Like I said, honor, honesty, truth come from a deep intellectual 
understanding of how the world works at its best. You can't cheat or fool 
Mother Nature.

[The Jarloker]
As Pirsig makes clear??? No where in that quote do I see "honor".

And from what I gather, "honor" can indeed involve dishonesty. Thinking 
about the Johnny Cash song, "The Long Black Veil", where the singer takes a 
murder rap rather than causing shame for his best friend's wife, isn't that 
an example of "honor"? At yet its both dishonest and a lie. I also looked 
up "honor" at Dictionary.com, not one reference to "truth" or "honesty". 
(http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/honor). So I looked it up at 
Merriam-Webster (http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/honor). No reference at all 
to "truth", and only one mention of "honesty", at the very end of the page, 
as a "see in addition", not even part of the 10 meanings MW provides.

As for Pirsig, well, the only use of it in ZMM is...

"[Plato] gives [arete] the position of highest honor, subordinate only to 
Truth itself."

In Lila, there are five times he uses the word "honor".

"Some of the most honored philosophers in history have been mystics."

"[Rigel] said, "Let me try another word: 'Honor.' The person we are talking 
about dishonored his wife and he dishonored his children and he dishonored 
everyone who put trust in him, as well as himself. People forgave him for 
his weakness, but they lost respect for him and that was what finished him 
for any position of responsibility." (this is the passage Steve and Ant 
have already referred to).

"Some of them, at least, would be at it, picking and sneering in the 
time­honored tradition of literary critics, musicologists, and art 
historians..."

"Why not bury the doll with full honors?"

"If Lila had been full of gratitude and attachment he would still be stuck 
with her. Now Rigel had that honor."

Hardly evidence of your assertion that "Honor is about truth and honesty. 
It's intellectual, as Pirsig makes clear."

Honor is a social-level value, as Steve and then Ant both have shown. Now 
if you'll excuse me, Johnny Cash bekons...