[MD] False Messiah

[Heather Perella]

Peter, Smith, dmb, Scott, and all,
 

     Peter said:  "Scott though, when you sit do you
wish for enlightenment or do you attempt some
movements of thought or awareness? If the first I'd
say that kind of wishful thinking won't get you much
but the second is well worth while."

     Peter that second would be Rinzai school, if your
talking about pondering koans.  Even though I think
about things at times in an exercise to understand
something in particular, I would also recommend a
third.  This third way of sitting involves not taking
any thoughts you might have and attempting to do
anything with them.  They come and they go, and soon,
in my experience, we just are here.  I wouldn't think
we are here - we just are, and what 'we' or 'just' or
'are' or 'here' even mean, is not something to be
inquired about at this particular Soto action.  Yet,
even this Soto action and Rinzai action get all mixed
up in this particular moment I am talking about.  It
is Zen, but what is Zen?  It is Quality, but what is
Quality?  It is God, but what is God?  Any answers to
these questions would not belong and last long in the
kind of experience I am talking about (the questions
themselves lead one no where, too).  


     Smith asked dmb (dmb answered this question, but
I would like to walk from this interesting question
into a comment of mine own), thus, Smith asked:  "Who
is the Pope of MOQ now?"

     I saw the movie 'V for Vendetta' this afternoon. 
One thing struck me about what a character in the
movie said about the hero.  The final event occurred
and then some other people had something to say or
their moments of doing.  She, though, said that she
would remember the man that started this all.  The man
that lead 'the event' (I am trying to not give away
the movie for those that wish to see it, but it is
obviously hard not to give some things away about
it.).  The whole time 'this man' wore a mask. 
Everybody wanted to see this man behind the mask.  He
said it is not the face or body behind this mask that
is important.  It is the idea.  The idea was seen
everywhere in bits in pieces.  Little kids to adults
all in their own way influencing each other in ways
they may not have realized it, but influence they did
until certain actions from these ideas popped up here
and over there.  This man was a hero, and was a major
character for this 'idea' motivating the 'events'
taking place until the climatic event.  Yet, here is
where I think something could go morally wrong.  She
wanted to remember the man.  The same man that said it
was not him, but it was the idea to contemplate and
take action with.  Yet, she literalized the idea into
one man.  That is morally wrong, because it cannot
happen.  The idea cannot be trapped in one man.  If,
social is a higher level than biological, and
intellect is higher than both, then this idea born of
intellect, spread into society, actualized in the
actions of biological beings, intellect (an idea) is
then something more than not just one man, it is even
more than many humans (society), an idea goes far
beyond any biological system and social activity of
many people.  Yet, she trapped the idea in one man,
against his understanding of where and what the idea
was.  She perverted the idea into one literal,
seemingly in her eyes maybe, separate cause of all
other events into this delineated person.  To remember
this one human and converge the idea into this one
human, and to be later, through history, become an
idea only linked with this one human being - now that
is perverted, morally wrong, and also a problem that
people in the future (using foresight) would find
themselves arguing over.  An idea is much more than
even a society of people, so how could it be
consolidated into one person. 
     This is what perverts budda, christ, and others
who lived the Way, walked listening to dharma, and
tried to express something, they themselves knew, was
much more than they themselves as individuals.
     So who is the Pope of MOQ?  I hope us all and
more.  I hope that is something we identify with as
where quality exists, too.  If we trap it any one
place, and yet, other places exist, yet, no quality is
found or trapped out of those places, then morally
something went wrong.  


     Scott, thanks for explaining about photons.  I do
remember now, that's what Einstein postulated.  Yet,
what of gravity that is none other than space-time? 
If, consciousness does this too, then what is the
difference between consciousness and gravity according
to what you are saying?  And since photons wouldn't
notice space-time, yet, everything else would that is
not traveling at the speed of light, then would
everything else be subjected to events of space-time
and our consciousness would be of those events
recognizing space-time.  Unless our consciousness is
traveling at the speed of light, but since we do
recognize space-time then this would be false.  How
this fits into False Messiah I am not sure?  It is
interesting, but I'm missing how this angles into the
subject.  I am not dismissing this, obviously, because
I am discussing and asking questions about it, but my
natural inclination (habitual way of approaching
various 'things') is to put them together into some
kind of coherent understanding, even if, that
coherency is open-ended.


SA

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