[MD] Intellect battles the[historical] barbarians

[Khaled Alkotob]

> [Khaled]
> The same thing happens on this forum. We are always saying " well 
> back in 1958..." or " when so and so was president". We cant's seem to
let 
> go of the past. In a way you need to know the past. Forgiving and
forgetting 
> is another story.
> 
> [Arlo]
> I'm not sure if this is a reference to my recent "history lesson", 
> but I'll  respond in case. My point in bringing up the historical
reality of 
> our
> involvement with Iraq (and Iran) is not to point blame, but to point 
> out that
> the hypocrisy of the "Moral Liberators". I wish, I truly do, that 
> there was a
> concerted effort to deal with these issues, but it all comes down to 
> Party
> Obedience, and an inability ON BOTH SIDES to accept blame where 
> blame is due.
> You can't sell a gun to a serial murderer and then act morally 
> indignant when
> he kills someone. Or better, sell a gun to a serial murderer and 
> keep selling
> him bullets while he kills other families, but then act morally 
> indignant when
> he kills your wife. Yes, the serial killer should go to jail, but if 
> you don't
> learn from your part in the play, you'll just turn around and sell a 
> gun to the
> next serial murdered... and soon he will take your child. This is 
> the game we
> are playing on the world stage.
> 
> But let's extend this. Let's see everyone else in the community 
> watches as their
> loved ones are killed by the serial murderer, using guns you sold 
> him. You
> don't care, because they aren't YOUR loved ones, but dontcha think 
> they're
> gonna end up really disliking you. And then when it is your loved 
> one, and you
> stand up all upset and cry immorality, do you really think they're 
> gonna take
> you seriously?
> 
> We can't change the mess Reagan created, and Bush Sr., Clinton and 
> Bush Jr.
> perpetuated. But we MUST acknowledge it, we must accept our role in 
> this. And
> then, we can hopefully move forward. But, really, given what you're
reading
> even here from the Holy Warriors, do you think that's gonna happen? 
> On either side?

[Khaled]

Arlo

This was by no mean a reference to what you said. In fact it's a failure
to learn form history that has gotten us into this mess. Some of the
things I was mentioning is the eye for an eye attitude, as Ghandi had
said, will eventually leave the world blind.
I mean how many more memorial need to be built in Germany to keep
reminding them of what happened in WWII. Don;t you think that it's a
lesson learned and every time they try to go on with their live they get
reminded with something else. Especially the new generation who was not
even born yet. An albatross around their neck fro generations to come.
That's the forgive and forget part I was talking about.

As for the points you keep bringing up to Platt about our history of
supporting dictatorship, that a lesson we are yet to learn. Let's see:

1. The shah in Iran
2. Saddam Hussein
3. Nasser against the Muslim brotherhood
4. Mubarak in Egypt
4. Pinochet
5. The House of Sa'ud
6. Soherto in Indonesia ( that was mainly England's doing)

The best line I hear is that we do such things because of "US interests".
I guess that is left to interpretation of what one calls interests and
others call recourses.

here is a couple  interesting links among many others I found

http://www.omnicenter.org/warpeacecollection/dictators.htm

http://www.cambridge.org/us/catalogue/catalogue.asp?isbn=0521678536

and the irony is this is a country that prides itself on freedom, voting
rights, democracy and so on.

To answer your questions if we are going to see peace after listening to
these holly warriors, well not for a while. Look at the billions of
dollars that we are spending to fend off the ideology of a few cave
dwellers. So much Jetsons and 2001 space Odyssey, hello fear, paranoia
and holy war. What a way to begin the third millennium.

We have been down this road before. Time will prove you and me and those
others on this group who can reason that we are right.

In December of 2003 I had a talk with the former chair of my journalism
department, and I told him exactly what is going to happen. He asked how
I can see the future, I said I am reading the past. I told him that when
Israel invaded Lebanon in 1982, they too were greeted as liberators in
south Lebanon. Then Hizbollah was formed and the rest is history. i told
him the same will happen in Iraq. Well 3 years later and I am right.



I think I am passed my 8 per day quota for posts.

Khaled