[MD] travelling vs tourism

Thu Aug 9 07:26:56 PDT 2007

Agreed Gav, then I misunderstood your view before.
Ian

On 8/9/07, gav <gav_gc at yahoo.com.au> wrote:
> i don't remember saying humans were incapable of an
> enlightened interactive relationship with their
> environment.
> by observing the patterns of nature and then
> understanding the processes more deeply one approaches
> the diaphanous laws themselves - or, more prosaicly
> perhaps, an ecocentric view.
> from here we can understand and therefore speak the
> language of nature...we can consciously add to the
> conversation. at the moment (as a society) we are not
> having a conversation at all.
> improving soils, rehabilating waterways, permaculture,
> alternative energies, reforestation...these are all
> within our capabilities as a society. we can
> dramatically improve, not just destroy, our
> environment.
> there is a school of thought in ecology that seeks an
> a-human ideal. that is ideally 'nature' should be left
> to itself. i strongly disagree. i think nature
> enriches us and is enriched in turn by us. any
> separation is abstract and alienating.
>
> --- ian glendinning <psybertron at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Hi Gav,
> >
> > Tourist - guilty as charged - just did the Beartooth
> > highway today
> > (between Laurel / Red Lodge and Yellowstone /
> > Gardiner) ...
> > breathtaking - awesome even, on so many levels. Most
> > of the vehicles
> > (even the motorcycles, of the thousands we met) had
> > bigger
> > environmental footprints than the one we drive.
> >
> > Carbon footprint, or whatever you measure, surely
> > there can be a
> > balance between the exploitation / damage and the
> > need to experience
> > and understand.
> >
> > Interesting you talk about custodianship and
> > nurture, whereas a couple
> > of weeks ago you were ranting about the presumption
> > that humans could
> > control or manage the eco-environment at all. I
> > can't see any
> > substitute for experience and well-informed balance
> > (and hope as David
> > says).
> >
> > Ian
> >
> > On 8/7/07, David M <davidint at blueyonder.co.uk>
> > wrote:
> > > Hi Gav
> > >
> > > Funny you should say that, I was wondering today
> > why
> > > we seem to make such a hell out of this life when
> > there
> > > is no necessity to do so.
> > >
> > > Thanks for the post.
> > > David M
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "gav" <gav_gc at yahoo.com.au>
> > > To: <moq_discuss at moqtalk.org>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2007 12:04 AM
> > > Subject: [MD] travelling vs tourism
> > >
> > >
> > > > end tourism now!!!!!!!!
> > > >
> > > > tourism is corporate travel: the mobile
> > spectacle.
> > > > comfort and convenience are paramount. tourism
> > is for
> > > > wieners.
> > > >
> > > > i just spent 5 days on fraser island, walking
> > and
> > > > camping. i ran into 10 other walkers, all cool,
> > > > friendly people from all over the world:
> > germany, US,
> > > > slovenia, australia. they all were totally rapt
> > in the
> > > > environment, were part of it and knew that to
> > despoil
> > > > it was out of the question: like masturbating in
> > front
> > > > of your mum.
> > > >
> > > > the tourists come in their droves in buses and
> > cars
> > > > into a world heritage jewel and they shit on it
> > and
> > > > they whoop and holler and display their
> > retardedness
> > > > for all to see. again the whole world is
> > represented
> > > > but it is the yanks and brits that are the most
> > > > obnoxious.
> > > >
> > > > lake mckenzie is a pristine freshwater lake that
> > is
> > > > dazzling to the eye. pure white silica sand
> > fringing
> > > > the perfectly clear water that contains the
> > azure blue
> > > > of the cloudless sky above. thick forest
> > encircles the
> > > > whole and creates what must be a shining eye to
> > the
> > > > birds above. on this pure white fine fine sand
> > are
> > > > flung dozens and dozens of cigarette butts. five
> > years
> > > > ag - my last trip - i would have had to search
> > hard
> > > > for one, but now the tourists are here in droves
> > and
> > > > their mindless destruction follows them, the
> > shadow of
> > > > their conflicted, twisted selves. this is
> > sacrilege!
> > > > this is blasphemy! this is so abhorrent, so
> > wrong.
> > > >
> > > > it is hard not to look upon tourists as dross
> > when you
> > > > are a traveller. you must always keep the heart
> > open
> > > > but this means that it flows outward in its pain
> > and
> > > > frustration also. the word 'tourist' is
> > pejorative
> > > > around the world and this is an example why.
> > > >
> > > > and yes i have been both. i have been both
> > tourist and
> > > > traveller and perhaps all travellers start as
> > > > tourists. it is important to remember this, i
> > tell
> > > > myself. the traveller is an individual; the
> > tourist is
> > > > part of the herd. the traveller is guided
> > > > intellectually, aesthetically; the tourist
> > socially.
> > > > the tourist IS a lower form of life and this is
> > why it
> > > > seems so.
> > > >
> > > > but i should end with my own experience because
> > it was
> > > > very special. i spent the time with an
> > ex-girlfriend
> > > > whom some of you know. our time together was a
> > ritual,
> > > > a transformation. one relationship ended and two
> > began
> > > > on that trip and we are both different people
> > than a
> > > > week ago.
> > > >
> > > > to be literally alone - noone around for 10 or
> > 20
> > > > kms; to be in ancient beautiful forest. to begin
> > to
> > > > feel the power, to begin to see the energy, to
> > begin
> > > > to get the 'aha!s' when your mind makes the
> > connection
> > > > between aboriginal art patterns and the subtle
> > > > energies of these truly wild places. to be
> > silent and
> > > > still and have the forest come to you and
> > envelop you
> > > > and absorb you and to begin to give gratitude
> > and to
> > > > begin to feel it coming back. the power spots of
> > this
> > > > world are the wild spots and they are in danger.
> > the
> > > > reason is always the same: the giant fears that
> > which
> > > > it can't understand; and it then destroys what
> > it
> > > > fears.
> > > >
> > > > i want to live in a world where nature and i are
> > > > entwined lovingly to the point of no
> > distinction.
> > > > i want to live in a world where life is
> > cultivated not
> > > > detsroyed, for that is our unique power as
> > humans: we
> > > > can be custodians who nurture and protect the
> > entirety
> > > > of the planet. we could create paradises beyond
> > our
> > > > dreams, instead, as a species, we are
> > manifesting hell
> > > > on earth. i guess thoreau saw it coming.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
> > > > Yahoo!7 Mail has just got even bigger and better
> > with unlimited storage on
> > > > all webmail accounts.
> > > >
> > http://au.docs.yahoo.com/mail/unlimitedstorage.html
> > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list
> > > > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
> > > >
> >
> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
> > > > Archives:
> > > >
> >
> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
> > > > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
> > > >
> >
> === message truncated ===
>
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
> Sick of deleting your inbox? Yahoo!7 Mail has free unlimited storage.
> http://au.docs.yahoo.com/mail/unlimitedstorage.html
> Moq_Discuss mailing list
> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
> Archives:
> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
> http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
>