[MD] Dawkins a Materialist (is watching?)
craigerb at comcast.net
craigerb at comcast.net
Fri Feb 9 21:10:48 PST 2007
[Micah]
> Nothing can be shown to exist independent of humans.
[Case]
> You are advocating some weird brand of solipsism.
[Craig previously]
> What is the argument for this claim? E.g.,:
> 1) Nothing can be shown to exist independent of humans
> 2) No other humans can be shown to exist independent of me
> 3) :. Nothing can be shown to exist independent of me
[Case]
> Actually with solipsism only number three is needed.
Yes, if you're just CALLING someone a solipsist, nothing but 3) is needed. But your claim was that 3) followed from Micah's 1). So I ask: where's your argument, if it is not 1) - 3)?
[Case]
> Micah's statement, "Nothing can be shown to exist independent of humans," is
> perhaps a tautology since the showing of existence requires someone to show
> it to.
Now you've really stepped in it. Originally you presented a reductio argument:
a) if 1) then 3)
b) 3) is false (because solipsism is false)
c) :. 1) is false
Now you're stuck with:
a) 1) leads to 3)
b) 1) is a tautology
c) :. 3) is true (solipsism is true)
Craig
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