[MD] Dawkins a Materialist (is watching?)

[Micah]

Probably been covered, but intelligence and behavior are human
characteristics, and an atom is not organized, it is - we perceive the
organization. Intelligence, behavior and organization is within us, not
without us.

"Intelligent Design" begs the question - compared to what other design?
Again, the universe "is" - the design is within us.



Micah


-----Original Message-----
From: moq_discuss-bounces at moqtalk.org
[mailto:moq_discuss-bounces at moqtalk.org]On Behalf Of David M
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 3:12 PM
To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
Subject: Re: [MD] Dawkins a Materialist (is watching?)


Ian/Arlo

My own vision is of a non-reductive, non-deterministic
science, ontological pluralism, that gives us a view of nature that
recognises
the active intelligence/behaviour that is in all life if not all forms of
organisation (an atom is a form of organisation) but evolves into a
higher human form, where most aspects of religion as we have know it
have been abandoned as authoritarian attempts at social control
but perhaps retaining some sense of the awe and sacredness
that this cosmic achievement should perhaps inspire.
Is that so awful and misguided?

David M




----- Original Message -----
From: "Arlo Bensinger" <ajb102 at psu.edu>
To: <moq_discuss at moqtalk.org>
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 5:15 PM
Subject: Re: [MD] Dawkins a Materialist (is watching?)


> [Ian]
> I think we're mixing up "the argument from intelligent design" with
> the drivel of IDC "creationists"
>
> [Arlo]
> According to Wikipedia, "Intelligent design (ID) is an argument that
> "certain features of the universe and of living things are best
> explained by an intelligent cause, not an undirected process such as
> natural selection." ... "In a leaked memo, commonly known as The
> Wedge Document, however, the supporters of the movement were told,
> "We are building on this momentum, broadening the wedge with a
> positive scientific alternative to materialistic scientific theories,
> which has come to be called the theory of intelligent design. Design
> theory promises to reverse the stifling dominance of the materialist
> worldview, and to replace it with a science consonant with Christian
> and theistic convictions."
>
> "Intelligent design", at its core, implies an "intelligent designER". No?
>
> [Ian]
> The argument is that, evolved, emerged design IS intelligent. The
> intelligent design IS the process of emergence, with no master plan
> or master intellect required or implied.
>
> [Arlo]
> I'm not sure I understand this. Can you expand a bit?
>
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