[MD] What's missing?

[Case]

dmb says:
I think the various cognitive structures that Piaget and others have 
identified in developmental psychology can very easily be used as a sort of 
window on our collective evolutionary development. You know, our collective 
evolutionary process is recapitulated in the maturation process of each 
individual member. Or so we hope. Anyway, Wilber's work presents a variety 
of concrete ways to make  distinctions between magical, mythical and 
rational cognitive structures, each corresponding to the various worldviews 
and types of culture. I mean, there is a scientific basis for drawing these 
sorts of lines. And these lines only imperfectly organize what is observed, 
of course. The lines are just ways to make sense of what we see in history, 
in our kids and in ourselves. Are you so much of a positivist and a 
behaviorist that you have already rejected any such developmental 
psychology? (And now with a Jerry Sienfeld accent...) I'm mean, come on!
What is up with that?

[Case]
(And now in my best Krammer voice:) "WHAT?"

I would caution you against using Wilberfied Piaget as the basis for much.
It has been a few months since I read Wilber's account of Piaget. I recall
enjoying his presentation and being grateful for the Piagetian overview but
at the same time Wilber's account did not square with my previous encounters
with Piaget or I thought he was stretching Piaget way past where Piaget
would be comfortable stretching. If it means a lot too you I will go back
through this and provide specifics. But yes one of the coolest almost true
facts of biology is that ontogeny recapitulates phylogeny. And I encourage
you to look into the real Piaget. 

I am not at all sure how you get from Piaget to "... magical, mythical and
rational cognitive structures, each corresponding to the various worldviews
and types of culture." and back to developmental psychology. Nor do I see
how developmental psychology is specifically at odds with behaviorism at
least from your perspective.

[dmb]
I think the comments from the letter are only pointing out that these
earlier structures are detectable in ancient artifacts, with the Bible being
one of the most well known among them. He's not saying they were stupid or
anything like that, of course. He's saying that the difference displays more
than just a different set of beliefs. Its reveals a different way of
thinking such that intelligent people could hold those beliefs. The bible is
full of stuff that simply makes no sense within our contemporary worldview
and everybody knows it. The stages or levels explain this difference WITHOUT
resorting to the idea that the ancients were just ignorant or stupid
compared to us.

[Case]
Well the fact of the matter is that the ancient were ignorant. It is also
true that we are ignorant of many things that influenced them. This mutual
ignorance limits what we can conclude about what they said and meant. But
the simply fact that not enough time has passed for there to be significant
physiological differences between us and them indicates that biological
evolution is not a factor. The fact that the ancients understood the world
differently than we do should not be shocking to anyone. They are remote
from us in time, place and culture. Almost nothing in our environments,
physical and intellectual has much in common. Any conclusions drawn from
this are speculative at best. And the more fanciful the conclusions the less
inclined we should be to buy into them.

There are a variety of ways to account for the differences between ancients
and moderns that do not involve lines, levels and stages that do not suggest
that either we or they are stupid or ignorant.

My biggest bitch with the track this has taken is the claim that social and
biological factors are the only ones at work in the Torah. Just the fact
that it was written down and a form of law was codified suggests an
intellectual process. The attempt to record history, the presentation of
answer to the question of "why" there is a rainbow or why there is something
instead of nothing, or why there is evil and suffering in the world, or why
the chosen people are in the state they are in. These are all intellectual
questions and while we may not embrace the answers given they are
intellectual answers.