[MD] Oui and Pirsig

[MarshaV]

Greetings SA,

I've read your post a few times.  I'm not understanding the point.  I 
sense guilt, but at what?  Do you think you must be fully embedded in 
society to have influence?

Marsha










At 08:13 PM 9/3/2007, you wrote:
>Thank you Ian.  I just finished reading Ouis'
>conversation with Pirsig.
>
>      Something of the article I would like to mention,
>for there is much more specifically discussed in the
>article upon different topics, but one topic that hit
>home for me.  If somebody is not finding good in what
>they do, then the value of what they are doing is
>disappearing and the relationship with the world
>devalued.
>       For me, my gut reaction has been to run.  To get
>away from society.  For the woods and I have had a
>good relationship.  My wife, son, and I have had a
>good relationship.  I stay on the MoQ.org, due to this
>relationship has been good.  The rest of society on a
>person to person relationship has not been as good.
>Therefore I find the quality on this social level to
>be hampered and not very valuable.  The intellectual
>level has been shaky at times.  I guess I've fallen
>back on the biological level at times due to a weak
>social level in my life.  I try to reach for the
>intellectual level for help, but it does not have all
>the answers, thus, my fondness for dynamic quality.
>      The social level is really a mess.  Pirsig
>mentions in the article how we are to look for the
>good and find the quality in events.  He likes the
>sunlight when he awakens.  Cloudy days are gloomy.  I
>see that my not so good evaluation of the social level
>in which I participate, and I'm not just talking about
>work; and I feel like I'm messing up at times.  I have
>trust issues.  I want to reach out to others at times,
>and I feel like I know what I could say to help
>encourage better relationships.  I want people to
>relax around me.  I want people to feel they can open
>up to me, and I want people to understand what I mean
>by experiencing closer and closer to what's going on
>with me - to make the effort to be in my shoes.  I'm
>trying so don't put me down, and think you know what's
>going on, what's the solution, and what's wrong with
>me, no don't think such 'things' unless your willing
>to get into the routine and see for yourself.  Yes,
>some of this is coming from my job, but relationships
>on the streets are very surface dependent,
>materialistic, and not much time is present to
>actually get together to not only discuss, but to
>dance as a community without thinking our hang-out has
>to be in the mall.  I don't know.  As Pirsig
>mentioned, he forgot why he went into the psych ward,
>and you know what, I'm forgetting, really I am, as I
>write this, why I don't like society.  I don't have
>all the answers to this why of mine.  I just have this
>nagging dislike and no-value attitude/relationship
>with the social level.
>       I remember writing a book collected from
>journaling I did from age 16 to ca. 20.  It had
>something to do with this.  I also wrote in one
>journal entry that I rejected society, but in another
>journal entry on another backpacking trip of mine I
>realized that as much as I don't like society I can't
>live without it.  So, how do I make amends?  Something
>really must have torn me up for I'm still feeling the
>shock of this discomfort to this day and I'm 31.
>Sometimes I think it's going away, and then other
>times, it's definitely not.  So, how do I make amends?
>  I don't think anybody can really answer this
>question, maybe not even me.
>
>woods,
>SA
>
>
>
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