[MD] A fine mess

[Ian Glendinning]

Hi Khoo, Andre,

Education, education, education; this is being debated in so many
places these days. Its been issue No.1 for a while, behind so many
other questions of ideologies, faiths and fanaticisms of all kinds.
It's the objectification (and the resultant simplistic commercial /
economic model) of that "paper qualification" that has spread from the
"western SOMist culture" to any erstwhile (Eastern) cultures competing
in the global / western economies. The eastward evolution of the
western meme has spread more successfully than the higher quality
alternatives. (I actually think it is the root of much intuitive
resentment to the west, even where it turns up in religious and
imperial guises.)

Don't get me wrong, I've done business in the Mid and Far East over
more than 20 years, I have no romantic view of "Easterners". They are
if anything sharper, more commercially competitive and astute (and
stronger work ethic) than the average westerner (in education as well
as business), if I were to generalize, but the objectives (values)
behind the point of a fast-buck / get-rich-quick (ie paper again)
seems to have been buried in the objects themselves everywhere we look
West or East. (It was my original "call to arms")

It is ironic that it is called a "qualification" no ? When it is
really a "quantification". When objectives (values) become objects,
they are so much easier for accountants to count, and harder for the
rest of us to value. Education without quality.

Regards
Ian

On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 11:49 AM, Khoo Hock Aun <khoohockaun at gmail.com> wrote:
> Andre,
>
> Just to add in to your point. I see education systems failing everywhere, in
> Malaysia, where I live.
> In China, under communist party ideology, where graduates from the system
> are mass manufactured.
> I dont know how different it is in the USA, but the relentless pursuit of
> the paper qualification can lead to
> the valueless situation where the cheat is the one to beat.
> I would have thought schools are where you go to get your character moulded
> and your values instilled. But
> whether its the waste of human minds in Communist China or mediocre Malaysia
> or in America, what is the
> difference ? Where has the Quality gone. We discuss this till kingdom come,
> but out there schools based on
> the principles of reasoning leave their bearings to others to provide.
>
> I used to think and I still subscribe to the idea that no institution on
> earth gives you an education.
> A good education is something to you give yourself.
>
> Regards
> Khoo Hock Aun
>
>
> On Thu, Dec 4, 2008 at 6:28 PM, Andre Broersen <andrebroersen at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Platt (to Bodvar):
>>
>> So on three counts, SOM intellect has not and can not regulate society with
>> anything other than detrimental effect. The survey of students mentioned at
>> the outset above reveals SOM's destruction of essential social
>> constraints.But, that's just the tip of the iceberg. A much more
>> significant
>> outcome of SOM's damage to the general welfare in the name of the "public
>> good" is the current economic crisis.
>>
>> Since SOM intellect is so damaging as I've outlined above and by going "too
>> far" as you say, I cannot help but wonder why Pirsig didn't come out more
>> strongly for less intellectual (government) control of society except to
>> protect individual rights and promote free markets. But, nobody's
>> perfect. :-)
>>
>> Hi Platt and Bodvar,
>>
>> Hope you do not mind me jumping in here but you 'tickled' my social worker
>> side. The survey you talk about is a result of SOM 'intellect', SOM
>> reasoning. 'The cause of our current social crisis, he (Phaedreus) would
>> have said, is a genetic defect within the nature of reason itself' (ZMMp
>> 110).
>>
>> 'Now it is not just depressingly dull, it's also phoney...stylized
>> cars,,,motors...food...clothes...children. You have to be awfully stylish
>> yourself not to get sick of it once it a while'(ZMM pp285/6).
>>
>> And I agree with Pirsig who then argues that this is so because 'no one has
>> ever told them that there's such a thing as Quality...'.(And that they are
>> a
>> [static/dynamic] 'representation' of Quality.
>>
>> In this sense we have to be careful to not only blame the victim Platt (I
>> hear what you say though) but it is not onesided. I do not think these kids
>> are evil. I think they are reacting to something that is fundamentally
>> missing in their lives and Pirsig sums it up pretty well.
>>
>> If you are interested (and if appropriate for this forum) I can relate some
>> ways the Chinese system deals with their children. (otherwise perhaps
>> privately)
>>
>> For what it's worth.
>>
>> Andre
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>
>
>
> --
>
> khoohockaun at gmail.com
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