[MD] dharma

MarshaV marshalz at charter.net
Thu Dec 18 02:30:50 PST 2008 

At 05:16 AM 12/18/2008, you wrote:
>Marsha,
>
>yes it is shocking to me that people, scientists even, can one moment appear
>rational and then the next seem (to me) completely irrational; belief in God
>for me is irrational - belief in a destructive, vengeful God even more so.
>Memes, behavioural instructions that are replicated in our brains by
>evolutionary mechanisms, help explain this for me.
>
>I have been reading Susan Blackmore's 'The Meme Machine' and feel greatly
>the better for it - especially the astonishing and completely unexpected
>final chapter: she had shown how our sense of free will, consciousness and
>selfness is an illusion and is then considering the implications of this
>conclusion. I quote:
>
>'Some scientists prefer to keep their scientific ideas and their ordinary
>lives separate. Some can do biology all week and go to church on Sunday. or
>be physicists all their life and believe they will go to heaven. But I
>cannot divorce my science from the way I live my life. If my understanding
>of human nature is that there is no conscious self inside then I must live
>that way - otherwise this is a vain and lifeless theory of human nature. But
>how can 'I' live as though I do not exist, and who would be choosing to do
>so?'
>
>Here is her astonishing recommendation:
>
>'One trick is to concentrate on the present moment - all the time - letting
>go of any thoughts that come up. This kind of 'meme-weeding' requires a
>great concentration but is most interesting in its effect. If you can
>concentrate for a few minutes at a time, you will begin to see that in any
>moment there is no observing self. Suppose you sit and look out the window.
>Ideas will come up but these are all past and future orientated; so let them
>go, come back to the present. Just notice what is happening. The mind leaps
>to label objects with words, but these words take time and are not really in
>the present.......'
>
>Sound familiar? She gives other such techniques, meditations if you will,
>for evading the tyranny of the self - I am sure you love that feeling of
>selflessness when you are deeply in your painting?

I've read Ms. Blackmore's book.  There was nothing I remember 
disagreeing with, but I felt it lacking something very 
basic.  Painting does it.  So does feeling the wind cross my 
face.  Or preparing rice.  Or,,, many experiences.

Thanks for the quotes.  She's a very cool woman.


Marsha




>That is why I say: let the neck be free, to let the head go forward and up,
>to let the back lengthen and widen...'
>
>-KO
>
>2008/12/18 MarshaV <marshalz at charter.net>
>
> >
> > Keith,
> >
> > One man's "scientific" theory of evolution is another man's allegory and
> > metaphor.  I get this.  It is, it isn't, it's both is and isn't, and
> > neither.  Who holds the illusion is an interesting question?  Pragmatic?
> >
> > The other day I was listening to C-SPAN's Washington Journal.  The question
> > was about Obama's choices for his "team".  A man called in to state that he
> > felt pleased with Obama's choices.  He made a very rational statement.  He
> > then went on to state that Obama should offer total commitment to Israel,
> > BECAUSE if we didn't GOD would destroy the world.
> >
> > Pattern?  Dharma?  Meme?  Not real, not not real?   The West is a fucking
> > mess!  (Pardon the appropriate word.)
> >
> > Marsha
> >
> >
> >
> > At 04:10 AM 12/18/2008, you wrote:
> >
> >> Marsha, you know i don't dissagree with the not and not not - and other
> >> shores - is too obfuscated for me - maybe because they cannot see the
> >> evolutionary picture and must always depend on allegory and metaphor.
> >>
> >> -KO
> >>
> >> 2008/12/18 MarshaV <marshalz at charter.net>
> >>
> >> >
> >> > Keith,
> >> >
> >> > and patterns...   It's the 'not and not not' that has me twisted.  I can
> >> > see it as clear as ..., but see nothing.  I read the words and they fall
> >> > through me.  Perhaps it's time to paint.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Marsha
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > At 04:02 AM 12/18/2008, you wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> Hi Marsha,
> >> >>
> >> >> teaching and entities of the mind - i see a strong connection with the
> >> >> idea
> >> >> of memes
> >> >>
> >> >> -KO
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> 2008/12/18 MarshaV <marshalz at charter.net>
> >> >>
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Dharma:  "A Sanskrit word that means "what is real," whether an
> >> object,
> >> >> an
> >> >> > event, or a teaching.  In the Abhidharma school, the term is applied
> >> to
> >> >> > entities of the mind."
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Not and not not, and I am skipping like a scratched 45-rpm record.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Marsha
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > .
> >> >> > .
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Shoot for the moon.  Even if you miss, you'll land among the
> >> >> stars.........
> >> >> > .
> >> >> > .
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> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > .
> >> > .
> >> >
> >> > Shoot for the moon.  Even if you miss, you'll land among the
> >> stars.........
> >> > .
> >> > .
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> >
> > .
> > .
> >
> > Shoot for the moon.  Even if you miss, you'll land among the stars.........
> > .
> > .
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.
.

Shoot for the moon.  Even if you miss, you'll land among the stars.........
.
.

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