[MD] moq thought experiment 1.

[Marsha]

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ham Priday" <hampday1 at verizon.net>
To: <moq_discuss at moqtalk.org>
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 1:47 PM
Subject: Re: [MD] moq thought experiment 1.


>
> Dear Marsha --
>
>> Show me an autonomous self.  What exactly is it?
>>
>> I asked you for a definition an autonomous self?   You answered
>> with a number of static patterns of value, analogies.  I think you
>> prove my point that self is a collection of interrelated, ever-changing,
>> static patterns of inorganic, biological, social and intellectual values,
>> and not autonomous at all.
>
>    Autonomy is "the quality or state of being self-governing".
>    --Webster' New Collegiate Dictionary
>
> The autonomous self is therefore one who is his/her own authority, whose 
> actions express his/her proprietary values, as opposed to the conventions 
> of a society, and whose beliefs are not an accommodation to external 
> agencies.
>
>> How is an autonomous self more than thoughts in your mind?
>
> Defining the self (psyche) in terms of its relational experience is like 
> defining a motorcycle in terms of its road history.  The result is an 
> analogy instead of a proper definition.
>
> Self (i.e., "selfness" or self-awareness) is the singular locus of one's 
> conscious being, or what we call the individual's unique subjective 
> identity.  Value-sensibility is the essence of experience.  But an 
> individual person is a dichotomy of Beingness and Awareness.  So the 
> fragmentation or differentiation of proprietary awareness into discrete 
> categories, such as specific feelings, desires, thoughts, objects and 
> events, is a function of the intellect working in conjunction with its 
> neuro-sensory contingency.  That's how the experiential self actualizes a 
> relational world from value.
>
> Have I answered your questions definitively enough, Marsha?  If not, keep 
> trying.


Ham,

So your 'autonomous self' is a bunch of concepts (static patterns of value). 
Do they change?  Are these concepts related to the body?  Are they 
influenced by society?  If there was a definition of self in the MOQ, I 
think the one I am using would be close:  collection of interrelated, 
ever-changing, static patterns of inorganic, biological, social and 
intellectual value in a field of Dynamic Quality.  I think your description 
sounds more like my definition than an 'autonomous self.  What would an 
autonomous self, an entity that is totally independent, desire?

Is an autonomous self one entity?

Marsha