[MD] The Menu/Reality issue

[MarshaV]

At 03:01 AM 11/15/2008, you wrote:
>Marsha.
>
>14 Nov. you wrote:
>
>  Ham:
> > > > Despite the confusion, it's apparent that at least three of us
> > > > understand that the "patterning" of Value is conceptual, which is
> > > > to say that objective phenomena are the intellectual constructs of
> > > > value perception.
>
> > >Bo:
> > >No confusion anywhere. The patterns being conceptual!!! Christ,
> > >what's not conceptual in the sense of being conveyed by language?
>
>Marsha:
> > While I understand spovs to be conceptual, no way do I understand that
> > to mean they are confined to language.  Images may be part of any
> > spov, or there may be an auditory part of a spov.   What do you think?
>
>Methinks that concepts (ideas) belongs to intellect's subjective realm
>different from its objective one. Nothing wrong with the intellectual
>level if understood in its MOQ context, namely that its subjective and
>objective halves are static parts of an aggregate, none having the old
>SOM-ish significance. But when you point to spovs as conceptual yet
>not confined to language, it sounds like you are in a no-man's-land
>between SOM and MOQ. In SOM language is manipulation of
>concepts and as we are "suspended in language" everything is
>"conceptual". In MOQ (that doesn't have any S/O distinction  outside
>intellect) language is merely a social pattern that intellect adapted for
>it's own S/O purpose  ... and the MOQ now uses for its DQ/SQ
>purpose. Yet, your assertion that the spovs are "conceptual" sounds
>as different from something non-conceptual - in a metaphysical sense
>-  and that SOM is back.
>
>Back to square one.
>
>Bo

Bo,

What of my point that there may be a visual or auditory piece to 
conceptual patterns (spovs).  Close you eyes and think about 
zebras.  There should be a composite of images brought to mind with 
that spov.  Or think about an eyeball.  Again there should be a 
composite of images brought to mind.  These images accompany 
language.  Think about a train and the sound of a train whistle is 
brought to mind.  These are not biological experiences.  There are 
conceptual experiences, as in memory.  That was my point.

Marsha









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The Universe is uncaused, like a net of jewels in which each is a 
reflection of all the others in a fantastic, interrelated harmony without end.
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