[MD] The Quest for Quality

[ml]

Bo (All),

Hello.  Sorry for not introducing myself,
but I am returning after a hiatus away
from the site.  (A couple of years?)

> Hi mel.
>
> (PS. wouldn't it be an idea to introduce yourself? Soon this site only
> consists of anonymous)
>


Not sure what an intro consists of these
days, so...

I've lost track of how many times
I've read ZMM /Lila.   Live in Colorado
and kayak when not working, and if
I am elected Miss America I will work
for world peace. errrr maybe not so
much the Miss America part.

Survived most of college, where there
were too many philosophers and
just enough Monty Python.  Was not
any good at doing drugs so, was forced
to grow up and work for a living.

Began to study Aikido and for a while,Iaido,
and glimped little cracks in prior world view /
led to searching for the man behind the
curtain, but Toto kept humping leg. Kept
sitting on round pillow.

Learned to write and fell down the rabbit hole
whole--getting lost in the study of complexity,
emergence,  and the edges of everything and
have been filling up notebooks and diskspace
with MOQ based analysis of modern social
systems and historical events--amazing how
lots of stuff untangles in that light.

Otherwise, just a regular guy on a regular street
inclined to disappear in the crowd, but with
a sense of humor...pretty boring really, but
hoping this beauty pagent has no swimsuit
portion.   (Sorry for the fippancy, but otherwise
all that's left is "read ZMM / Lila and am boring.)

Oh, and Craig?  -will try to remember to cut
the extraneous from Re: messages. thx.






<snip>
> "...flashes through perception before ...etc." makes it sound as if there
> is a perception prior to Quality. This was valid in ZAMM where SOM
> ("intellect" in retrospect) was the only (static) fallout and it (SOM)
> presupposes a perceiving subject (and P. of ZAMM reasoned from
> SOM's premises) but in the MOQ one can't speak about perception
> prior to anything.

Precicely.  Which made the assignment of "GOOD" post cognition
and at a definite remove, and speaking about it even more so.

(From your modification of my response I think we are on the same
page regarding this, but my incomplete response left room for
implications not intended.)

As to the word 'perception' this gets a little sticky to discuss and
likely definition-bound.  However one describes it, whatever word
or phrase that you find most useful, there is a definite ...mmmm
'awareness-of-consciousness-of' that preceeds cognition.

Awareness of consciousness of, and Quality are indeed INSEPARABLE,
but naming, lableing, classifying are cognition after the fact, as I see it.
(Maybe I was unclear on precisely how close the assumtion of the mapping
of meaning was, linking GOOD and QUALITY, in the post to which I was
replying.)


>The levels ARE perceptions of Quality, but most
 >participants of this site are bent on a "subject" prior to Quality and/or
 >the MOQ as some subjective theory.

Correct on the first clause.  However, the moment we begin to
apply language we use a tool that is conditioned and structured
to imply SOM reasoning, so that assumption is REALLY, really
hard to escape-- years worth for me to take my baby-steps with.
When that 'rabbit hole' opens it is a very subtle thing to slide off
the SOM soap bubble. Damn hard to discuss.

thanks--mel