[MD] Ironistic Metaphysics

[MarshaV]

Hi Gav,

I do not know much about Rorty, but I meant RMP being a true sophist.  


Marsha
 
 
 



-----Original Message-----
From: moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org
[mailto:moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org] On Behalf Of gav
Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2009 8:31 PM
To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
Subject: Re: [MD] Ironistic Metaphysics


cheers marsha,
in any case i was def a bit hard on rorty...the spirit is okay, its just,
aesthetically, he hurts my brain.
gav ironfist

--- On Fri, 7/8/09, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:

> From: MarshaV <valkyr at att.net>
> Subject: Re: [MD] Ironistic Metaphysics
> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
> Received: Friday, 7 August, 2009, 10:04 AM
> 
>  
> Maybe the act of a true sophist...     
>     
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org
> [mailto:moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org]
> On Behalf Of gav
> Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2009 7:39 PM
> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
> Subject: Re: [MD] Ironistic Metaphysics
> 
> 
> hiya,
> 
> > Hi all,
> > 
> > What is metaphysics? Does everyone have a metaphysics?
> Or
> > can people get by without being metaphysicians?
> > 
> > Rorty:
> > "I shall define an "ironist" as someone who fulfills
> three
> > conditions: (1) She has radical and continuing doubts
> about
> > the final vocabulary she currently uses, because she
> has
> > been impressed by other vocabularies, vocabularies
> taken as
> > final by people or books she has encountered; 
> 
> gav: i thought we were speaking english. seems i was
> mistaken
> 
> 
> (2) she
> > realizes that argument phrased in her present
> vocabulary can
> > neither underwrite nor dissolve these doubts; 
> 
> so she doubts? 
> 
> 
> (3) insofar as
> > she philosophizes about her situation, she does not
> think
> > that her vocabulary is closer to reality than others,
> that
> > it is in touch with a power not herself. Ironists who
> are
> > inclined to philosophize see the choice between
> vocabularies
> > as made neither within a neutral and universal
> > metavocabulary nor by an attempt to fight one's way
> past
> > appearances to the real, but simply by playing the new
> off
> > against the old."
> 
> wtf? jesus. looks like ironist metaphysicists are those
> that lose themselves
> in self-referential (meta-)drivel.
> 
> does he mean ironic? which would actually get closer to the
> heart of the
> matter...ie the truth, the nebulous, dynamic,
> all-encompassing truth loves
> irony, it is a creature of paradox...hence tetralemmic
> shenanigans.
> 
> it's not the vocab, its how you use it; the hermetically
> sealed world of
> bullshit jargon makes 'philosophers' look like dickheads as
> far as i can
> tell. shakespeare didn't need meta-vocabs, neither did
> pirsig, the measure
> of thought is its comprehensibility, the measure of a
> thinker is his ability
> to render his conception in analogues that are as generally
> comprehensible
> as possible.
> 
> in the end mytho-poetry is the higher logic, the logic
> beyong the literal,
> the logic that reconciles opposites, that moves past the
> wild oscillations
> of the relative. this is the wisdom of the heart - 'when
> the heart rules the
> mind the living is divine' (tim rogers).
> 
> it is only in the heart that we know certainty, know the
> tao: the heartmind
> as the chinese say....don't we all know this already?
> 
> quality is aesthetically apprehended. it has to be lived,
> incorporated,
> felt....analysis, alone, separates, it hinders this
> integration when left
> unchecked. 
> 
> anyway
> 
> 
>  
>
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