[MD] The relativity of the MoQ

[Steve Peterson]

Hi Ron,


> Steve,
>  I thought the premise behind the 4 levels was not only better  
> understanding
> but
> the breaking of the paralysis of cultural relativism, and  
> relativism in general,
> I got the feeling throughout Lila that that was the problem western  
> society faced.
>
> and the arguement Pragmatism lacked
>
> you know
>
> virtue, excellence..betterness...Quality
>
> virtually both books are about the feelings of emptiness and  
> detachment
> objectivism unleashes in the form of moral relativism.
>
> I agree it is not about what is true, but it IS about what is better.
>
> beliefs are justified through use in expereince otherwise they have  
> no value.
>
> what else would be discussed than what values are better than others?
>
> and what framework would yield those answers but MoQ?
>
>
>
>
> I'm not sure how "I think therefore I am" figures into the  
> conversation
> in this regard.


Steve:
I was referring to this bit from Lila:
"Our scientific description of nature is always culturally derived.   
Nature tells us only what our culture predisposes us to hear.  The  
selection of which inorganic patterns to observe and which to ignore  
is made on the basis of social patterns of value, or when it is not,  
on the basis of biological patterns of value. Descartes' "I think  
therefore I am" was a historically shattering declaration of  
independence of the intellectual level of evolution from the social  
level of evolution, but would he have said it if he had been a  
seventeenth century Chinese philosopher?  If he had been, would  
anyone in seventeenth century China have listened to him and called  
him a brilliant thinker and recorded his name in history?  If  
Descartes had said, "The seventeenth century French culture exists,  
therefore I think, therefore I am," he would have been correct."

The MOQ is not immune to this sort of historical contingency either  
and so then is also culturally derived. This is not a dig on the MOQ.  
Everything is culturally derived. At least the MOQ includes an  
understanding of that fact.

Twentieth century liberalism exists, therefore Pirsig thinks,  
therfore the MOQ exists.

Best,
Steve