[MD] Reductionism

[blue-jay maple]

  In a civil society, dmb, the free market includes the exchange of intellectual 
ideas.  Nobody forces you to talk and think.  It is about 
non-coercive economic and intellectual exchange.  Anything else 
is an advocation for initiation of physical coercion and is anti-liberty.  


Nick
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "david buchanan" <dmbuchanan at hotmail.com>
> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
> Subject: Re: [MD] Reductionism
> Date: Sun, 7 Jun 2009 10:52:42 -0600
> 
> 
> 
> Ron said to John:
> I am not a detractor of Platt, I just dislike his tactic of 
> transferal from a relevant discussion of David Bohm and how system 
> theory functions in relation to physics into demonizing him as a 
> purveyor of evil. Convolutedly drawing a parallel from systems 
> theory to Bolshevism. Just to bait for an irrelevant arguement to 
> incite yet another pointless degeneration into an Arlo/Krimel/Platt 
> ad hominem flame war.
> 
> 
> dmb says:
> The irony in Platt's convoluted nonsense is that systems theory is 
> used quite extensively to support and explain free market 
> economics, social darwinism and Adam Smith's invisible hand. It is 
> used to justify Platt's ideology. It says humans act out of 
> rationally calculated self-interest so that each individual is the 
> "part" while the economy is the "whole". All these individual 
> selfish acts add up to a functioning structure, they say. Thus you 
> get slogans like, "greed is good" and selfishness is seen as a 
> virtue. Sadly, guys like Richard Dawkins are pushing genes and 
> memes as parallel notions in biology and culture. As I see it, this 
> is exactly what Pirsig was talking about in his complaints about 
> rational and scientific amorality. The free market system caters to 
> any desire and when you look around it seems to be all about 
> Doritos and Coke. Mostly, it just leads to a kind of gasoline 
> powered hedonism.
> Not that I'm above that sort of thing. My friends and I recently 
> enjoyed champaign and caviar while camping in the desert. That 
> ice-cold coke I drank after our trek through a canyon was pure 
> pleasure and later, around the campfire, those roasted marshmallows 
> really hit the spot. But that's probably how the dog felt when he 
> ate that lizard but I'm sure he doesn't know anything about Adam 
> Smith or Social Darwinism. My point? There is nothing noble about 
> catering to such desires. These are just biological values, 
> creature comforts. And to the extent that we put these values above 
> social and intellectual values, we are just pigs with jobs, as Ron 
> so aptly put it. In that sense, Platt's position always strikes me 
> as rather low-brow and degenerate.
> What I like best about camping is the conversation. Campfire 
> philosophy is far more delicious than any corn chip and often warms 
> me better than the fire does. I like to believe that campfire 
> philosophers go all the way back to the beginning of human history, 
> that it's the second oldest tradition we have. Why not the oldest 
> tradition? Because cooking meat is just a little older. Or so I 
> imagine. Naturally, we did that too.
> 
> 
> 
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