[MD] Patterns s/o or relationship???

Tue May 5 15:22:34 PDT 2009

Greetings,

MINDWALK is based on Fritjof Capra's 'The Turning 
Point'.  When this VHS tape was available, I 
bought many to give to friends and family.  It 
has never been made into a dvd version, and it is 
unavailable to purchase as a vhs version, new or 
old.  If anybody would like a dvd backup copy 
sent to them, let me know offlist.  It's a great movie.

Marsha

At 03:09 PM 5/5/2009, you wrote:
>Marsha, I would love a copy, I'll give you an 
>address off-list, what I know of modern standard 
>theory is that entities are assumed in order to 
>use mathematical calculations. for example: " In 
>1926, Erwin SchrÃ¶dinger, using Louis de 
>Broglie's 1924 proposal that particles behave to 
>an extent like waves, developed a mathematical 
>model of the atom that described the electrons 
>as three-dimensional waveforms, rather than 
>point particles. A consequence of using 
>waveforms to describe electrons is that it is 
>mathematically impossible to obtain precise 
>values for both the position and momentum of a 
>particle at the same time; this became known as 
>the uncertainty principle, formulated by Werner 
>Heisenberg in 1926. In this concept, for each 
>measurement of a position one could only obtain 
>a range of probable values for momentum, and 
>vice versa. Although this model was difficult to 
>visualize, it was able to explain observations 
>of atomic behavior that previous models could 
>not, such as certain structural and spectral 
>patterns of atoms larger than hydrogen. Thus, 
>the planetary model of the atom was discarded in 
>favor of one that described atomic orbital zones 
>around the nucleus where a given electron is 
>most likely to exist.[25][26]" Â  "In the 
>Standard Model of physics, both protons and 
>neutrons are composed of elementary particles 
>called quarks. The quark belongs to the fermion 
>group of particles, and is one of the two basic 
>constituents of matter—the other being  the 
>lepton, of which the electron is an example. 
>There are six types of quarks, each having a 
>fractional electric charge of either +2/3 or 
>âˆ’1/3. Protons are composed of two up quarks 
>and one down quark, while a neutron consists of 
>one up quark and two down quarks. This 
>distinction accounts for the difference in mass 
>and charge between the two particles. The quarks 
>are held together by the strong nuclear force, 
>which is mediated by gluons. The gluon is a 
>member of the family of gauge bosons, which are 
>elementary particles that mediate physical 
>forces." Â  Historically, the hadrons (mesons 
>and baryons such as the proton and neutron) and 
>even whole atoms were once regarded as 
>elementary particles. A central feature in 
>elementary particle theory is the early 20th 
>century idea of "quanta", which revolutionised 
>the understanding of electromagnetic radiation 
>and brought about quantum mechanics. For 
>mathematical purposes, elementary particles are 
>normally treated as point particles, although 
>some particle theories such as string theory 
>posit a physical dimension. Â  All elementary 
>particles are either bosons or fermions 
>(depending on their spin). The spin-statistics 
>theorem identifies the resulting quantum 
>statistics that differentiates fermions from 
>bosons. According to this methodology: particles 
>normally associated with matter are fermions, 
>having half-integer spin; they are divided into 
>twelve flavours. Particles associated with 
>fundamental forces are bosons, having integer 
>spin.[3] Â  Â  ________________________________ 
>From: X Acto <xacto at rocketmail.com> To: 
>moq_discuss at moqtalk.org Sent: Tuesday, May 5, 
>2009 2:30:51 PM Subject: Re: [MD] Patterns s/o 
>or relationship??? Marsha, I know you like to 
>think of most physicsts as being stuck in the 
>1930's but most of the physicists who still 
>thought in terms of objects are either dead or 
>retired. I know you and Platt were just 
>communicating, sorry for stepping in, I just 
>thought that u-tube link was terribly 
>interesting. -Ron 
>Â  ________________________________ From: 
>MarshaV <marshalz at charter.net> To: 
>moq_discuss at moqtalk.org Sent: Tuesday, May 5, 
>2009 2:19:00 PM Subject: Re: [MD] Patterns s/o 
>or relationship??? Ron, I agree with you.Â  It's 
>impossible to find the words, and why 
>understanding the nature of these patterns 
>(word-labels) is ........Â  Â  There is no 
>common assumption.Â  At their most 
>understandable they're relationship, but in the 
>end they are so much dust in the wind.Â  If you 
>want to be the hammerer on top, be my guest.Â  A 
>hammer is not as elegant as an X Acto Knife.Â  I 
>was just trying to communicate with Platt. As 
>far SOL being obsolete for MOQ'ers, I was 
>thinking of yet-to-be MOQ'ers.Â  And Earth to 
>Ron, many physicists do not know other than s/o 
>with lots of space. Marsha At 01:43 PM 5/5/2009, 
>you wrote: >Platt, Marsha, >Â  Basically that is 
>what she is saying only she uses the term 
>relationship >which is commonly understood as 
>interaction between objects, but, she >already 
>states that what we assume as objects are 
>actually greater sets >of relationships, 
>relationships of relationships or a better word 
>for what >she is describing is value. > >As I 
>keep hammering on, common assumptions about 
>common terms >in our culture is what creates 
>philosophical paradox , the failure >of 
>rationalism. Our language is based on the 
>grammatic predication >of subjects and objects. 
>So even when we hear the term relationships >we 
>automatically conceptualize the interaction of 
>objects and have difficulty >even forming 
>concepts about entityless abstractions. The same 
>goes for value, >The terms "value" and 
>"relationship" are almost meaningless 
>without >the conventional conception of 
>objects. >Physicists have understood the 
>inherent emptiness of reality for the 
>past >60-70 yrs but has yet to percolate to the 
>public. >This is why SOL is redundant and 
>obsolete, as MoQists >we already know this, 
>physicists already know this. >Pirsig uses the 
>lingual distinction of Dq/Sq just to 
>avoid >essentialism in 
>conception. > >-Ron > > > > > >__________________ 
>______________ >From: "plattholden at gmail.com" 
><plattholden at gmail.com> >To: 
>moq_discuss at moqtalk.org >Sent: Tuesday, May 5, 
>2009 7:16:19 AM >Subject: Re: [MD] Patterns s/o 
>or relationship??? > >On 5 May 2009 at 6:56, 
>MarshaV wrote: > > > > > Are all physicist as 
>enlightened as this one??? > > > > 
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRduOpj1R7c&feature=related  
> > > > > > > 4:05 minutes > >Marsha, > >Don't 
>you think this physicist would be more 
>enlightened if she had >acknowledged the role of 
>values in the structure of the 
>universe? >Emphasizing relationships and 
>interconnections as she does strikes me 
>as >assuming an S/O premise. > >Thanks for the 
>link. > >Platt > >Moq_Discuss mailing 
>list >Listinfo, Unsubscribing 
>etc. >http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_d 
>iscuss-moqtalk.org >Archives: >http://lists.moqta 
>lk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >http:/ 
>/moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > > >  
> > >Moq_Discuss mailing list >Listinfo, 
>Unsubscribing 
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>iscuss-moqtalk.org >Archives: >http://lists.moqta 
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Shoot for the moon.  Even if you miss, you'll land among the stars.........
.
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