[MD] QRE: The 4th. level's two interpretations. Par

[MarshaV]

Andre,

Patterns are patterns are patterns.  Analogues are analogues are analogues.
Either Lila has quality, or Quality has Lila?  I've suffered my share of
pain, but it has nothing to do with now.  To speculate and publicly discuss
imaginings concerning RMP's biography is not something I am comfortable
doing. I think he is very beautiful, and I hope he is happy.


Marsha    










-----Original Message-----
From: moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org
[mailto:moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org] On Behalf Of Andre Broersen
Sent: Monday, November 09, 2009 2:44 PM
To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
Subject: Re: [MD] QRE: The 4th. level's two interpretations. Par

Marsha to Andre:

Hello Andre,
What is 'manic'?

Andre:
Hi Marsha, below I have posted the DSM IV classification of the manic
'disorder':


Manic Episode

DSM IV Criteria

A) A distinct period of abnormally and persistently elevated,
expansive or irritable mood, lasting at least 1 week (or any duration
if hospitalization is necessary)

B) During the period of mood disturbance, three (or more) of the
following symptoms have persisted (four if the mood is only irritable)
and have been present to a significant degree:
1) inflated self-esteem or grandiosity
2) decreased need for sleep (e.g., feels rested after only 3 hours of sleep)
3) more talkative than usual or pressure to keep talking
4) flight of ideas or subjective experience that thoughts are racing
5) distractibility (i.e., attention too easily drawn to unimportant or
irrelevant external stimuli)
6) increase in goal-directed activity (at work, at school, or
sexually) or psychomotor agitation
7) excessive involvement in pleasurable activities that have a high
potential for painful consequences (e.g., engaging in unrestrained
buying sprees, sexual indiscretions, or foolish business investments)

C) The symptoms do not meet criteria for a Mixed Episode

D) The mood disturbance is sufficiently severe to cause marked
impairment in occupational functioning or in usual social activities
or relationships with others, or to necessitate hospitalization to
prevent harm to self or others, or there are psychotic features.

E) The symptoms are not due to the direct physiological effects of a
substance (e.g., a drug of abuse, a medication or other treatment) or
a general medical condition (e.g., hyperthyroidism)

Andre:

The reason I mentioned it is related to Pirsig's interview with Tim
Adams in the Observer ( Nov. 19,2006)

This is after Phaedrus was released from the psychiatric institution:

'When he was released, it only got worse. He was crazier; he pointed a
gun at someone, he won't say who. He was committed by a court and
underwent comprehensive shock treatment of the kind described by Ken
Kesey in One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest

I wonder if that old depression ever returns?

'I've been hit with it lately,' he says. 'It did not seem related to
my life in any way. I have money, fame, a happy wife, our daughter
Nell. But I did for the first time go to a psychiatrist. He said it's
a chemical imbalance and he prescribed some pills and the depression
has gone.'

Andre:
>From my limited work in psychiatry (I have worked in the field for
two-and-a-half-years), it seems to me that Pirsig is suffering from a
bi-polar affection. He admits he is still on medication. I sometimes
wondered from reading both ZMM (the attraction to jump from the cliff)
and from Lila (the rather morbid thought about how long it would take
to fall from the hotel balcony, he is standing, on to hitting the
ground).

I do not question the sincerity of his feelings and am still trying to
give them a place within the overall understanding of the MoQ (
otherwise he would not have included them in both books.

I must also hasten to add that I think that this in no way has
affected the brilliance of the MoQ or the brilliance of its creator
and writer. Rather it has further awed me for respect for Mr. Pirsig.

Any thoughts?

Marsha:

What conclusion must I jump to?  None!  Society protecting itself, or
the shaman/artist seeking protection?

Andre:

A bit of both I think Marsha. It points to the difficulty in finding
the balance between static PoV's and being open to DQ (in whatever
'form' it comes) i.e. how does one tell the difference between the
saint and the crook? As Pirsig admits; it is usually time that
tells... . (not very satisfying I know).

Marsha:

I admire Bo.

Andre:

So do I Marsha, please do not get me wrong about my regard for the man.

Cheers

Andre
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