[MD] Socrates ,Protagoras and the "relative"

[X Acto]

----- Original Message ----
From: John Carl <ridgecoyote at gmail.com>
To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
Sent: Fri, November 13, 2009 12:27:36 PM
Subject: Re: [MD] Socrates ,Protagoras and the "relative"

On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 7:14 AM, X Acto <xacto at rocketmail.com> wrote:
Ron:
> This is the point that is being missed about Platos dialog of
> Protagoras, it is the discussion about Socratic method
> Protagoras is credited as developing.
> Everyone loves to paint Plato as a dick but Socratic method
> is an excercise of relativism, it's used to break down what we think
> we know as true.

John:
But in this breakdown, there is an ideal held as truth to be measured
against.  "our" truth is relative to "the" truth or its meaningless.

Ron:
Well, theres a rather nice place to start, what are we holding our notions
of truth and the "real" to?..see this is what I think drove people like
Aristotle to develop scientific method. The question of what can we know?
Ron:
In fact it is the defining dialog which gives rise
> to the work of Aristotle.
> Plato, using Socrates and Protagoras, destroys everything we think we know
> as relative and  then builds on that aporia.
> Relativism is a method of destroying bias assumption and prejudice not so
> much a philosphical view in it's own right to camp on.
>

John:

Ah, I see.  It's just a relative relativism, not an absolute one.

???


Ron:
You don't see a difference between method and philosophical viewpoint?
I think the method speaks to an entirely different philosphical viewpoint
one based in the inquiry of value rather than the hammering on the meaningless.
>
> Much like the Zen, they tear you down with koans(180), then build you up
> (360) zen, the circle is complete when to extend out into the world and
> begin
> the process with others with your own head heart and hands.
>
> The relativist, the 180, the half enlightned, would say:
> "thats YOUR opinion and meaningless to me"
>
>

John:
Or they could equally say, "well that's my opinion and meaningless to you."

John the 79% enlightened  (too damn lazy to fill in that extra 21 I guess)

Ron:
yea fuck it


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