[MD] (Fwd) Re: British Emergentism

[skutvik at online.no]

Hi Andre

27 Nov.

Bodvar before,
> And now I want to introduce the Newton Gravity talk again because it
> contains the first outline of Phaedrus' quest. You all know how it
> goes, P's claim is that things falling to the ground was dynamic and
> did not "stabilize" as gravitation until Newton, i.e. gravity was
> created by Newton!! Not as an explanation of something - this is SOM
> and looks obvious in its hindsight - but as a new "gravity reality".
 
Andre:
> Just to nit-pick here Bodvar, Newton did not invent gravity! Based on
> his observations of the falling apples he created a LAW to explain
> this phenomenon. 

>From SOM seen "... Newton created a law to explain gravity" is plain, 
but are we here to ruminate SOM? It's obvious that this parable is 
important for understanding Phaedrus original Quest - namely 
unending SOM's eternal "subjective theories/about objective reality". 

> This LAW is commonly called the Law of Gravity. When you think about
> it, in the context of what we are talking about, this is a huge
> difference. 

Yes, and I hope our view overlaps . This is ZAMM where Quality had 
just one static "level" namely SOM (called "intellect" there) while in 
the final MOQ is gravity a static inorganic pattern that intellect (in its 
science capacity) later found the laws of.  

> Pirsig did not 'create' Quality. Pirsig created a metaphysics, a
> coherent statement of reality, based on (and emerging out of) the
> dominant form of reasoning (SOM) plus dynamic experience, and called it
> the MoQ. (and its history is known). 

Well, here is the clue, Pirsig DID create Quality according to his own 
reasoning in ZAMM, and I believe this is the reason for his reluctance 
to translate ZAMM into moqish, it would nullify his silly "Quality/MOQ" 
postulate. But that would not be bad, rather his idea's fulfilment. MOQ 
is a quantum leap from SOM and a new reality emerges wherein the 
static levels emerged out of DQ in the known sequence . Insisting om 
a Quality independent on the MOQ is just more SOM and creates the 
same paradoxes.

IMO as always

Bodvar