[MD] Problems with Intellectual control of Society

[John Carl]

Mark,
Platt and I both appreciated Allan Bloom's book on this subject, The Closing
of the American Mind.

*Bloom's assertion was that German Social change in the 30's was wrought by
an intellectual/philosophical evolution that we in America are following and
its his prediction that America is headed for a similar catastrophic social
upheaval.   As you point out, they weren't simply stupid.  But maybe its
more difficult to make the same case for us - after all, we have a concrete
example to warn of consequences.*

*
*
On Thu, Oct 8, 2009 at 11:02 PM, markhsmit <markhsmit at aol.com> wrote:

> Hi Platt,
>
> I have done some research on the similarities between the current regime
> in the USA, and the elected party in Germany in the 30's (much of it
> talking
> with my Dad, who was a teenager in Holland during the War).  The
> similarities are interesting.  The Germans weren't stupid people back then,
> and neither are we, now...
>
> Cheers,
> Willblake2
>
> On Oct 8, 2009, at 1:55:15 PM, plattholden at gmail.com wrote:
> From:   plattholden at gmail.com
> Subject:    Re: [MD] Problems with Intellectual control of Society
> Date:   October 8, 2009 1:55:15 PM PDT
> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
> On 8 Oct 2009 at 12:44, John Carl wrote:
>
> > Platt,
> >
> > On Thu, Oct 8, 2009 at 9:26 AM, <plattholden at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Good point, but I think a fixed system that promotes DQ, like capitalism
> > > and the MOQ itself, is better able to avoid disaster Or, if disaster
> > > occurs,
> > > DQ systems are likely to lead to a quicker recovery than static S/0
> > > intellect systems.
> > >
> >
> >
> > Platt, capitalism operates on the profit motive - that is a fixed static
> > system of value whereby individual corporate entities care most about
> their
> > own relative success - in a very competitively modeled framework.
> >
> > By "competitively modeled" I mean the entire legal and regulatory matrix
> > which evolves out of cut-throat competion and thus perpetuates it.
> >
> > Perpetuates a system far beyond it's ability to be anything like
> "dynamic"
> > ever again.
> >
> > Thus, DQ is not being sought by capitalism. I'd say by far the opposite.
> > Self interest is the avowed engine of capitalism and the self as a source
> > of value is a false metaphysical premise to begin.
> >
> > SOM, in case you've heard of it.
>
> One look at history is all one needs to be convinced that capitalism
> (profit motive/competitiveness/self-interest) fosters innovation, the
> result
> of being open to the evolutionary force towards betterness of DQ. This is
> well explained in Lila, Chp. 17.
>
> > > You nailed it with the phrase, "govt/media complex" -- as great a
> danger
> > > to a free society as a military/industrial complex.
> > >
> > Well, I owe that one to Savage - a fascinating guilty pleasure whereby I
> > alternate between being fascinated and appalled.
> >
> > But one could as well call it, as John Gatto did, the education-media
> > complex. When he attacked the modern American system of education, he
> also
> > roped in the fact of how much tv a kid watches compared to classroom
> time.
> >
> > But in this day and age, is not education simply an extension of the
> > government?
>
> Yes, and frightening, too. You saw on TV the kids singing the praises of
> Obama, hmm, hmm, hmmm? Remind you of anything, say, Germany
> circa 1933?
>
> > An interesting time for me to be thinking about this stuff, my wife
> loaded
> > Orwell's 1984 into I-Tunes to play while she peels apples and bakes
> pies....
>
> Man you married well!
>
>
> > > I consider these last two paragraphs full of wisdom. In fact, it is
> wise to
> > > challenge intellect based on the S/O premise, as Pirsig has so ably
> > > demonstrated and as you have done in this thread..
> > >
> > > Platt
>
>
> > Woo-hoo!
> >
> >
> > A "platt-a-boy".
> >
> > I live for those things.
>
> If so you should get a life. :-)
>
>
>
>
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