[MD] irony and socrates

[John Carl]

>
>
> You still have some Q-fundamentals wrong, namely that writing and
> reading is Q-intellectual activity  in which case the Bible or Koran are
> "intellectual pleas" to believe in (their respective) God.
>

I don't get this at all.  First, reading and writing can be intellectually
patterned, or not.  It Depends.

Second, I take Christ's advice to those who make intellectual pleas to
believe:

Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land
to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the
child of hell than yourselves.  Matt. 23:15

And I note you say "respective", but they the practitioners claim its the
same God - the God of Abraham, Moses and Isaac.


>
> There's too much yelping about "dynamic". This is something
> frightening and awesome involved in the emergence of new levels (not
> in the inter-level play) the last of which was the SOM-MOQ transition.
>



Bo, what I mean by Dynamic is not simple "change".  Everything that exists
is held in *dynamic* tension - at the Quantum level at least.  And most
patterns that are stable are likewise in a dynamic state that is relatively
stable at any one moment.    On the 2nd level of biology, those genetic
patterns which increase the dynamic are those which are more adaptable.   DQ
is the unexplained phenomena which drives natural selection toward
betterness.





> There is some level-like relationship between the uppermost static
> level - intellect - and the MOQ itself. Before the MOQ "intellect" was
> SOM and hated being made a sub-set of the MOQ*)  And when
> Phaedrus wandered beyond SOM's perimeter he was  struck down by
> SOM-as-intellect's "immune system".
>


>
> *) This is the Q-tenet of each lower level resisting any "system" above
> itself. Inorganic value trying its best to prevent life and so on upwards.
>


What a negative guy you can be sometimes Bo.  The very picture of inorganic
values grasping at death is ridiculous to me.



>
> Now, I wander, but I feel that  both the social and intellectual levels -
> and the level relationship - is misunderstood - even by Pirsig of LILA
> who at times loses sight of his own original insight that SOM = intellect
> (there were no levels in ZAMM) and flaunts an  intellect which is more
> like a mental compartment,.i.e. SOM's "mind". OK, you don't say it
> here, but I use every opportunity to bark up the nearest tree.
>
>
The frantic barking of a dog which is trapped by a collar that it wants to
install on everyone else.  If you can't reason your way out of intellect,
then nobody can, right?





> > Holding intellect as the highest good would be "intellectualism" or
> > "objectivism". .....
>
> The intellectual level is the highest and best and if you see it as
> "objectivism" very good,  the objective attitude is better that the
> subjective.


I think Ron's insight that S/O thinking also objectifies the "self" or
subject, needs to be kept in mind.  SOM is Objectivism.   I grant only DQ
the label of "highest and best".  Objectivism is often the lowest and worst
of all patterns when it tries to immorally suppress dynamic evolution.  The
Inquisition was evil.  Hitler was evil.  The proponents of these systems
used intellectual tools of objective manipulation to further their evil
ends.  I don't see how you can call this "highest and best".

Oh wait, you think Nazism was just a social phenomena.   What a Babylon you
encompass.



> ......  I agree that DQ is more important, but I disagree that it is a
> >  level above the 4th.
>
> Arrrgh. the "level" issue again. I said that there is a quasi level
> relationship between intellect and the MOQ, but the MOQ must be
> seen for what it actually is, namely the DQ/SQ Metaphysical System.
> It's everywhere..
>
>

Well I definitely agree that the DQ/sq orientation is everywhere, working
through and between the levels which are derived from it.  More on this said
elsewhere...


> BTW I am to have a show of my paintings come december and may
> be a bit distracted these days
>
> Bodvar
>
>
An artist who miscomprehends intellect?  Am I shocked?   Good luck on your
show.  Make some money in a down economy.  I'm rooting for you.