[MD] concerning SOL??

[Joseph Maurer]

On 9/4/09 6:57 AM, "Steve Peterson" <peterson.steve at gmail.com> wrote:

<snip>
Bo:
> It was SOM (represented by his colleagues) that asked Phaedrus this
> question and the fact that they saw it as a dilemma shows that it was
> regarded unavoidable - Quality HAD to fit the S/O matrix - something
> that shows that it was the ONLY way of thinking there were.
 
Steve:
Note that this question did not occur to Pirsig in his initial
musings on Quality. Instead it occurred to some of his colleagues as
a way to challenge what he was saying. Was Pirsig not participating
in intellectual patterns before he tried to answer this question?
You've limited intellect to asking yourself a single question about
objectivity versus subjectivity. Certainly asking this one question
is not the only intellectual pattern. I never ask it when I'm
factoring a polynomial for example or when I'm trying to decide
whether I should be using the word "who" or "whom" when I am
constructing a sentence. In fact, I'm only asking this question when
I happen to be asking this question.
 
Best,
Steve
 
Hi Bo, Steve and all,

Imho Mathematical logic is only useful if  ³1² has been established
metaphysically.  Pythagoras was instrumental in the definition of the logic
of ³1².

At the SOM level before Pirsig, mathematics ruled.  S was undefined and only
O was one.  Evolution was impossible, and morality was the survival of the
strongest man.  Women were not invited to participate.  With evolution
³quality² is more inclusive metaphysically than ³1² in that it is undefined
and evolves.  Mathematical logic has no argument to define a transcendental
³1².

Joe 


> Hi Bo,
> 
> 
> On Sep 4, 2009, at 3:47 AM, skutvik at online.no wrote:
> 
>> Hi Steve
>> 
>> 2 Sep. you wrote:
>> 
>>> I completely agree that it sounds very strange to say that the
>>> intellectual level is a single fact/value rather than the
>>> collection of
>>> ALL intellectual patterns of value.
>> 
> Bo:
>> Do you find it strange that all biological patterns are about one
>> single
>> fact/value: LIFE?
> 
> Steve:
> Here you are pretty much saying that all biological patterns are
> biological since biology means having to do with life. All biological
> patterns have something to do with life just as all intellectual
> patterns have to do with using symbols, but life is not the only
> value on the biological level. For example, "might makes right"
> describes a biological pattern that is not equivalent to "the value
> of life." Hunger is a biological pattern of value that is not
> equivalent to life. Killing is a biological pattern that is not
> equivalent to life. So I would never define the biological level as
> "the value of life" but instead define it as the collection of all
> biological patterns of value.
> 
> 
>> Steve said:
>>> Certainly the habit of mind that involves asking "is this
>>> subjective or
>>> objective?" is one such pattern of value, but it is just one.
>> 
> Bo:
>> It was SOM (represented by his colleagues) that asked Phaedrus this
>> question and the fact that they saw it as a dilemma shows that it was
>> regarded unavoidable - Quality HAD to fit the S/O matrix - something
>> that shows that it was the ONLY way of thinking there were.
> 
> Steve:
> Note that this question did not occur to Pirsig in his initial
> musings on Quality. Instead it occurred to some of his colleagues as
> a way to challenge what he was saying. Was Pirsig not participating
> in intellectual patterns before he tried to answer this question?
> You've limited intellect to asking yourself a single question about
> objectivity versus subjectivity. Certainly asking this one question
> is not the only intellectual pattern. I never ask it when I'm
> factoring a polynomial for example or when I'm trying to decide
> whether I should be using the word "who" or "whom" when I am
> constructing a sentence. In fact, I'm only asking this question when
> I happen to be asking this question.
> 
> Best,
> Steve
> 
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