[MD] Loneliness

[MarshaV]

Hi Dave,

To me intellect and intellectual refer to a type of static pattern.  Your
conclusions are your static patterns of value.  I may conclude differently.



Marsha    





-----Original Message-----
From: moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org
[mailto:moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org] On Behalf Of David Thomas
Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2009 4:53 PM
To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
Subject: Re: [MD] Loneliness

Bo,John,

My pass at a defining the intellect:

The intellect:..is...³the human ability to CREATE and VALUE ideas about
experience.² It is an individual and group activity. The MoQ's intellectual
level at any point in time contains the highest quality, most valuable, most
useful conclusions about experience. And all these conclusions are subject
to revision if better interpretations come along.

Dave




On 9/12/09 2:12 PM, "Bodvar Skutvik" <skutvik at online.no> wrote:

> John
> 
> 12 Sep you wrote:
> 
>> Intelligence and Intellect.  Which is the level and which is the
>> aspect? 
> 
> Help me untangle the Gordic "intellect-intelligence" knot (in the
> American English language) where it seems to have undergone some
> symbiosis. Intellect was never meant to be identical to intelligence.
> Animals are regarded intelligent to lesser or greater extent but never
> intellectual - not even the smartest chimps or dolphins. How could
> Pirsig at first say that the intellectual level was "just thinking" - and
a
> lot of participants uphold this fallacy - all the time it's obvious that
it's
> RATIONAL thinking, i.e. the ability to look objectively on things and
> shun everything subjective. That this is SOM  (The Church of
> Reason")  and thus the 4th.level is just as plain. That LILA rails
> against the C of R in its science form and shows how often
> subjective-personal motifs interfere is another thing, that's to show
> intellect's social origin.
> 
> Me earlier:
>>> "Patterns objectified for analytical thinking". That sounds like an
>>> OK definition of intellect.
> 
> John:
>> Yes.  I agree that it does sound like an ok defintion.  And since
>> objectification is SOM, it makes perfect sense that SOM=Intellect.
>> In that regard then, the 4th level is Mind, not "Intellect".
> 
> Are you bent on driving me mad? ;-) There is nothing wrong with
> MOQ's level design, it's just that it rejects the subject/object
> distinction as existence's fundament, ergo there is no mind or matter
> in the MOQ and  what we call "intelligence" does not take place in
> mind because all S/Os are gone with the wind. The ability to
> manipulate experience (memory) simply emerged with biology's
> increasing neural complexity and with Homo Sapiens' huge brain it
> grew enormously. OK, this - at first limited - prowess was (still is)
> used by the biological level for its purpose, then adapted by the social
> level for its purpose and finally by intellect to promote its S/O value.
> And at this level the S/O's flourish.
> 
> Bodvar
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>> Do we have final vocabulary?  (Sorry you Rorty detractors, I haven't
>> even read the guy but I do like that term)
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>  but I did of course mean "Intellect is supposed to
>>> be a MOQ level".
>>> 
>>> Bodvar
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Not anymore!
>> 
>> John
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>> 
> 
> 
> 
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