[MD] Imaginings

[ARLO J BENSINGER JR]

[John]
Reform.  Right.  Let's just pick the one real good monocultural view of reality
that is appropriate for everyone. 

[Arlo]
That's not the reform I'm talking about.

You know, you actually had me laughing out loud at this post. You say you favor
"diversity", and your solution to encourage that is to set up schools so that
every particular "culture" can isolate itself away from the presence of anyone
who is not like them.

You've been talking about "religion" as the only real "cultural" marker so far.
I gather then you see "vouchers" setting up schools based on segregating the
various religions in America. 

And you see religiously-segregated schools as encouraging greater diversity in
thought from schools where children from various religious background attend.
That is your contention? I want to make sure I understand this.

[John]
Mormons.

[Arlo]
So you're contention here is that Mormon kids learn better when they are
segregated out and learn exclusively among other Mormons. 

Its the presence of "non-Mormons" in the public schools that cause those Mormon
kids to fail? Is that right?

[John]
You tell me, professor.  I have no idea.

[Arlo]
I think the presence of multiple cultural populations enhances learning
personally, but at the worst it shows that it does not HINDER it, as appears to
be your claim.

[John]
Uh, hello?  Social conformity is  only like their highest value.  Not as a
race, but as a culture, you gotta admit that they are a lot less prone to
individual spontaneity.

[Arlo]
Oh man, do YOU need a Tokyo vacation! I would say that a large segment of the
Japanese culture values social conformity, as does a large population of
Americans (conservatives, for example). There are static and dynamic elements
in BOTH cultures, but Japan is rich in intellectually diverse thinking. As is
Finland. 

[John]
Well my argument would be in broader strokes, that I think American culture
tends to promote intellectual diversity much moreso than Japanese Culture.

[Arlo]
American culture has proven more apt to social disconformity, much to the bane
of conservatives. We have hippies and beats and all sorts of social deviants
(good and bad). Japan has them, to be sure, but I don't know if this is what
you are talking about, as you brought the conversation back to religion again.

So, you are saying that there is 


[John]
I would say that on the whole, Americans today are not nearly as culturally
diverse as they used to be.  I think the media-education complex has had an
effect of homogenization.

[Arlo]
Really? Jeez. From what I hear the "media-education complex" has been a
corrupting element because it does NOT foster "homogenization". Every complaint
I hear about "diversity" revolves around how "education" has stopped the
"melting pot" by creating subcultures that retain their unique distinctions
despite achieving citizenship....

And YOU are telling me that its the opposite! That education CAUSES a melting
pot where everyone "homogenizes"?! Yowza!!!

But let me stop and say, from what I can tell, we both favor diversity in
intellect and social mannerisms. Correct?

[John]
Remember my assertion of Bioregional Politics?   nations and states  evolve
values from their PLACE on the planet, not just geologically, but
geographically,  Finland, Japan and America each have unique places and stories
which create their cultures.  Part of America's culture is a melting pot. 
Japan is not a melting pot.  You can be a third generation immigrant to Japan
from Korea, and you are never going to be Japanese.

[Arlo]
I agreed with your points about bioregionalism. I have no problem with schools
attending to the unique, geographically-driven cultural needs of a local
population. THAT is quite a bit different from saying that catholics and jews
would learn better segregated away from each other.

[John]
No, but I think a lot of trauma and stress on my friends part could have been
avoided with a bit more cultural sensitivity - cutural arrogance being  the
idea that we all think just alike and everyone is equally served by the
centralized system.

[Arlo]
Again, decentralize education, make it serve the local and specific needs of
learners. Reform it. But keep it public. Privatization is not the answer. 

[John]
Well, you state that this something you struggle for from within the system,
trying to steer the behemoth along the right path, but deny the opportunity for
any one else to try and solve the problem in their own unique way.  Why?

[Arlo]
Because privatization is not the answer. It ignores the root problem. The
educational needs of our society is best served by a strong, reformed, public
education system, one that is valued and integrated and supported into the
local communities.

[John]
You don't think that is significant?  You don't think America is more
religiously oriented than the rest of the world? 

[Arlo]
Parts of it, but the question is not Grass Valley. The question is, if
"uni-culturalism" is the answer, why do the schools in Oklahoma and Nebraska do
worse than the schools in Tokyo, an international and diverse city?

Are you suggesting this difference can be attributed to the variety of
religious orientations in Oklahoma? Again, are you saying that the PROBLEM here
is that baptists are forced to learn side-by-side with episcopalians? That it
is "religious diversity" that makes the Oklahoma public schools fail?

[John]
You don't think that all these seriously religious people don't have a bit of
an axe to grind against the imposition of a values free metaphysic upon the
impressionable minds of their children?

[Arlo]
Ah, so the problem is "secularism"? The reason why public education fails is
that there is no "God" in the schools? By your charge, the catholic schools in
America should be better than the public schools in Japan, right? 

[John]
Nah.  you don't see this as a form of social control imposed by centralized
authority upon diverse cultures.  Or if it is, it's "for their own good" in
your eyes.

[Arlo]
Wait, what are you accusing me of again? Forcing cultural homogenization? Or
encouraging cultural diversity?

[John]
No wonder you get so upset with Platt.  He'd rip this to pieces.  Or rather,
pull out his Zen bow and ZING 'em into your bulls.

[Arlo]
Riiiiiight. That's funny. By the way, Platt has always accused me of the
opposite of what you appear to be doing. He tells me my system encourages
diversity, when it SHOULD be encouraging homogeneity. Your telling me I
encourage homogeneity, when I should be encouraging diversity.

And your solution to encouraging diversity is to segregate all the various
"cultural groups" into their own schools?? Ai yi yi... 

[John]
Socialization with peers is probably the most essential aspect of early
education, when you think about it.

[Arlo]
Sure is. Let's just make sure they don't have to interact with kids who are
different than they are, it'll make them fail out of school.