[MD] The MOQ/Zen relationship.

[MarshaV]

Greetings Andre,

Are you saying my statement is incorrect?  I think that to understand the
emptiness of self and phenomenon is to eliminate the tendency to grasp which
causes suffering.  But I am not a Buddhist, so I could certainly be
misinterpreting the dharma.     


Marsha





-----Original Message-----
From: moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org
[mailto:moq_discuss-bounces at lists.moqtalk.org] On Behalf Of Andre Broersen
Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2009 3:58 PM
To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
Subject: Re: [MD] The MOQ/Zen relationship.

Marsha to Bo:
It seems to me the Buddhist use intellect and meditation of penetrate the
illusionary nature of self (subject) and phenomenon (objects).  That is
moving beyond a subject/object world-view.

Andre:
I like this Marsha, even though I haven't thought it through...which will
never happen) but wanted to respond anyway. I tend to think that the
Oriental mind-set (if there is such a 'set') never bothered much with the
intellectualising (i.e  S/O dividing) because it did not meet with their
confrontation/experience of their ENVIRONMENT as reality.

The Buddha took his environment as reality (sickness,old age, suffering,
death) and constructed the illusory 'quality' from this...and, once
penetrated (awakened') reaching a state of 'awakening'. It went 'through'
this.

The Western mind-set did take the S/O mind-set as real(y) and truly
reflecting their confrontation/experience of their environment as
reality whilst , in this process, constructing conceptual arguments (along
dialectical lines) that this mind-set was an illusion (appearance and
ideal). In this way it had set up its own paradoxes. It remained 'stuck' in
this.

Andre