[MD] now it comes

[Mary]

Hello dmb, Horse, Magnus, Arlo, et al,

The problem is not with the word 'static'.  The problem is with the word
'concepts'.

The levels are not 'concepts'.

Best,
Mary

> On 26/07/2010 19:30, david buchanan wrote:
> > Bo asked:... And moreover who says that SQ are "static concepts"?
> except DMB.
> >
> >
> > dmb says:
> > MOQers, this is a great example of why it is completely pointless to
> discuss anything with Bo. He asked the question just a few days after I
> showed BO that James and Pirsig both say what static concepts are.
> Further, it is a passage from Lila that I have quoted and explained
> many, many times.


> 
>   That's SIMian logic for you Dave - in severe danger of disappearing
> up
> it's own ineptitude.
> Bo's version of the MoQ is so incredibly mangled that I don't believe
> that anyone who adheres to it has the faintest chance of making sense
> of
> what Pirsig has said in his writings. And given the general level of
> nonsense created in support of Bo's version this appears to be the
> case.
> The passage you quote seems to be very clear in what it says but
> explaining this to Bo is pointless because he has no interest in seeing
> anything in any way other than in terms of his SIMian interpretation. A
> consequence of this is that what you say will be similarly distorted
> because it doesn't conform to Bo's interpretation and therefore ends up
> mangled in the same way as almost everything that Pirsig has said.
> 
> Could I interest you in a nice hard wall against which you can bang
> your
> head - it feels so much better when you stop!
> 
> Horse
> 
> On 26/07/2010 19:30, david buchanan wrote:
> > Bo asked:... And moreover who says that SQ are "static concepts"?
> except DMB.
> >
> >
> > dmb says:
> > MOQers, this is a great example of why it is completely pointless to
> discuss anything with Bo. He asked the question just a few days after I
> showed BO that James and Pirsig both say what static concepts are.
> Further, it is a passage from Lila that I have quoted and explained
> many, many times.
> >
> >
> > "...he [James] meant that subjects and objects are not the starting
> points of experience. Subjects and objects are secondary. They are
> CONCEPTS derived from something more fundamental which he described as
> 'the immediate flux of life' ... James had condensed this description
> to a single sentence: 'There must always be a discrepancy between
> CONCEPTS and reality, because the former are STATIC and discontinuous
> while the latter is dynamic and flowing.' Here James had chosen exactly
> the same words Phaedrus had used for the basic subdivision of the MOQ.
> ...Value, the pragmatic test of truth, is also the primary empirical
> experience. The MOQ says pure experience is value. ...Value is at the
> very front of the empirical procession."
> >
> > Further, Bo keeps misinterpreting the relationship between DQ and sq
> AS IT IS EXPLAINED IN THIS PASSAGE. As any literate person should be
> able to see, Pirsig and James are both saying that subject and objects
> are BOTH static concepts. That is to say neither are dynamic. Bo thinks
> that I think DQ is equal to an objective reality and sq is equal to
> subjective mind. Nope. That not what James or Pirsig or I am saying.
> Subject and objects are both static concepts. DQ can NOT be equated to
> either of them because they are BOTH derived from DQ.
> >
> > Does anyone, other than the usual suspects, have any problem grasping
> this? It's just so clear and simple to me that I'm a bit stunned that
> anyone could fail to see it, let alone fail year after year after year.
> Is there something confusing about that passage?
> >
> > Calling all sane people, calling all sane people. I need a reality
> check.
> >
> >
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
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> >
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> --
> 
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> - Frank Zappa
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