[MD] Stuck on a Torn Slot

[118]

Hi dmb,
Thank you for your response.

On Thu, Dec 2, 2010 at 11:03 AM, david buchanan <dmbuchanan at hotmail.com>wrote:

>
> Mark said:
> ...  A concept can be seen as a static framework.  It is a useful tool to
> encourage discussion, but must remain dynamic.
>
> dmb says:
> No. Marsha makes this move too and it's one of the stupidest moves I've
> ever seen.
> Does anyone really need to explain why it's a bad idea to say that STATIC
> concepts must remain DYNAMIC?
> This is not even a philosophical issue. It's just about an obscene abuse of
> the english language. Static means stable, which means it is not dynamic.
> Concepts need to be stable or they don't work as concepts. That's why ideas
> and concepts are called intellectual static patterns. They are stable and
> structured. This does not mean they are eternally fixed or permanently
> rigid, but stability is a good thing and stable is simply what the word
> means.
>

[Mark]
Yes, this is what I said.

[dmb]

> Ordinary communication depends on this stability of meaning. If every
> english speaker re-invented or reversed the definition of words whenever
> they felt like it, communication would be rendered impossible. Thinking
> would be impossible. To construe "static" as meaning "dynamic" is
> conspicuously, spectacularly wrong. It blurs the main line of the MOQ and it
> defies all our dictionaries. Are you members of the english-speaking
> community or not?
>

[Mark]
If you are speaking of words, then we have a dictionary.  Does a dictionary
of concepts exist?  I don't think so.  Any concept is dynamic.  A single
concept can have multiple interpretations, that is why we have discussions.
 If you are interested in dogma, then you are in the wrong place.  Perhaps
there is an MOQ_dogma that you need to create.

[dmb]
> It's ridiculous that anyone should have to make a correction as obvious as
> this one. How can a grown-up be so ridiculously confused about the
> distinction between static and dynamic? It's as simple as saying "hot" does
> not mean "cold" and "up" does not mean "down". Each term means what it means
> by NOT being the other. Static means not dynamic in the same way that cold
> means not hot. Up is the opposite of down in the same way that static is the
> opposite of ever-changing.For the same reason - a decent respect for common
> understandings - static patterns are NOT ever-changing. Dynamic is exactly
> what they are not.
>

[Mark]
Again you are speaking of words.  I am not sure if you have the flexibility
for discussion.  Give me a static pattern that will never change, and I will
show how you are stuck.  How hot is hot?  Give me a static temperature.  Up
is with reference to to observer, it can never be static.  Perhaps a better
understanding of what you mean by static is in order.  How static does
something have to be to be static?  Perhaps you could use your training in
radical empiricism to described this.  Put your education to work.  Your
misplaced rage is not productive and somewhat irrational.

>
> Sigh.
>
> Sorry. Obviously, I'm all out of patience. You guys are just too much.
>

[Mark]
I understand, this is a difficult subject.  Thanks for trying as best you
can.

Mark

>
>
>
>
>
> Moq_Discuss mailing list
> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
> Archives:
> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
> http://moq.org/md/archives.html
>