[MD] Thus spoke Lila

[MarshaV]

Hello Tim, John and Mark,

To me Mark is closer to heart when he describes it as DQ.  It is outside 
all static patterns, and to the degree it is experienced brings joy.   


Marsha
 
 
 
 

On Dec 17, 2010, at 2:49 PM, John Carl wrote:

> Tim and Marsha,
> 
> [Tim]
>> I think it is here that you have given me the link I needed to express
>> myself to Marsh.  This arty, feely, aestheticy thing is what I was
>> getting at with 'heart' - when I said that I was in your camp.  However,
>> I think the intuition that had me insert 'anything else?' is what I need
>> to make it come together - without it even the finest art would be
>> torture (I had made the contention, to Ham, that pure sensibility would
>> be torture).  There is an intellectual aspect surrounding DQ!
> 
> 
> John:
> 
> I agree.  Isolated from mind, "heart-fulness" is just as insane as
> mindfulness focused solely on intellect.  The two are inextricable.  Pirsig
> encapsulates it well with his formulation "science that is ugly and art that
> makes no sense".
> 
> The Eastern ways of liberation encapsulate it well with that bit of
> graphical idealism - the yin/yang symbol.
> 
> I look at "DQ" as the pull on the human heart and mind, which drives us to
> create logical and beautiful expressions of reality.  And I think the guy
> who equated "Truth" and "Beauty" made a good point.
> 
> 
> Tim:
> 
> 
>> One has
>> to be able to choose to quit the particular art that, if forced upon him
>> long enough, would be torture.  This will of the I is vital.  And, since
>> when we come out the other side of the doorway of DQ, we must decide
>> before we know what we are deciding: pre-intellectual awareness, we have
>> to have some aspect of pre-awareness choice.  There is so much we might
>> be aware of at any moment, but the choice to be aware of that specific
>> locale of reality came prior to it.  (Either this is effifying DQ) or
>> else there is a third intellectual component (at least) which is the
>> intelligence needed to choose amidst this unknown.  It seems that there
>> is a counterpart (for balance) on the front end too: a willful act
>> requires a choice at the front (what is important, best), and with this
>> in possession, some sort of _____________ (what?) which predisposes the
>> 'I' to a preparedness for the future that is to come.  A faith aspect to
>> intelligence if you will.
>> 
>> I think we see eye to eye on the lukewarm versus balance business.  :-)
>> 
> 
> John:  "eye to eye" is an interesting aphorism to me, as it plays with one
> of the two modes of human perception - sight, what we perceive as an
> holistic image that we take to be real.  As opposed to the hearing of the
> word that we perceive as being true.
> 
> 
>> 
>> [Tim]
>> probably no better way to 'deal with it' than by play!
>> 
>> 
> "As a human being you are a collection of many things: skin, bones, brains,
> experience and emotion.  But more than all of that, you are your
> expectations.  That's why I choose to be optimistic."  -- Scott Adams
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