[MD] Language

[david buchanan]

The so-called Pythagoreans, who were the first to take up mathematics, not only advanced this subject, but saturated with it, they fancied that the principles of mathematics were the principles of all things. —Aristotle , Metaphysics 1-5 , cc. 350 BC


Ron said:

This is where Bo would say that the distinction between intelligence and intellect is the philosophical belief that the principles of mathematics are the principles of all things.

dmb says:

The idea that reality can be described in terms of mathematics extends from the Pythagoreans to Einstein but there is a very important difference that gets washed out when we project our sense of what physical equations can do backwards in time. The Pythagoreans were mystics. It was a kind of Orpheus cult. Their sense of what it meant for mathematics to be the principle of all things was basically a musical idea. The vibrating strings of a musical instrument (the lyre, distant ancestor of the guitar, sitar and harp) could be described mathematically and a "science" of harmony grew out of that discovery. This was added to a belief that said, "As above, so below". The heavens were conceived as a series of concentric crystalline spheres, like giant nested glass balls in which the stars were embedded. As these spheres revolved, it was supposed, the friction produced an particular note on the musical scale. Taken all together, the universe itself sang in perfect harmony. By listening to music here on earth, they thought, we are brought into harmony with the whole cosmos. The idea here, basically, is that musicians tune your soul and otherwise bring you into accord with reality. Like the use of astronomy and math to produce temples of worship in Egypt and Babylon, this was a very axial thing to do. They certainly were capable of manipulating abstract symbols in a skillful way, but the purpose was essentially religious or spiritual. Oh, I should say that according to the myth of Orpheus, who was the son of Apollo and the Muse of epic poetry, was held to be the greatest musician who ever lived. He sang songs about the genealogy of the gods and it was said that the beauty of his music was so compelling that rivers would change their course in order to be nearer, trees would uproot themselves to get closer and even the wildest animals would calmly gather to listen. And it is my own personal belief that this crucial historical moment also gave birth to the two drink minimum. And don't forget to tip your server.  

Ron said:

This is a perfect illustration to my point. It was with the Pythagoreans that the concept of "substance" emerged. I think RMP's real SOM bogeyman is the Pythagoreans developing into Neopythagoreanism.



dmb says:

Plato was, among other things, synthesizing the work of a whole range of pre-Socratic philosophers including the cosmologists. You can see the notion of substance coming from these cosmologists. The old idea that our world is composed of four elements (earth, water, air and fire) is a kind of synthesis of the various pre-Socratic positions. But there again, these elements were not conceived as merely physical as we might today but rather as spiritual forces. Later, these two streams would come together to produce the groovy sounds of Earth, Wind and Fire, who would go on to win ten grammies and a place in the rock and roll hall of fame and the Hollywood walk of fame whereas Orpheus was only raised to the level of a divinity and was given his own constellation. 



















 		 	   		  
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