[MD] Hoy stoves and those who sit on them

[Andre Broersen]

  Ham:

There is no way of knowing ANYTHING apart from the individual.
>  There is also no way of VALUING anything apart from the individual.
>  The individual is the point of reference for all of reality.
>
>  (So, why is the individual subject slighted in the MoQ?)
>
>
John:

Because the individual, when objectively analyzed, requires context for
definition of itself and proper self-understanding.  Without realization of
context, individuation disappears.  Thus the individual cannot be taken as
fundamental all by itself, without causing all kinds of metaphysical
problems.

duh indeed.

Andre:
Agree John. It seems as though Ham still does not understand co-dependent
origination. As he suggested in a post the other day:

'You are also correct in stressing that nothing arises independently (i.e.,
by its own power), and that everything in existence is related and
co-dependent. All except the knower, that is'.( MD Vol 52, Issue 140)

Andre:
Now, do you understand this? All is dependently arisen...except the knower.
How stupid can we get?