[MD] re ron

[John Carl]

Greetz to you, Adrie,

On Fri, May 28, 2010 at 11:10 AM, Fam. Kintziger-Karaca

Idea's are produced by individuals, ideas's are not collective-generated .
> But the collective of course can adapt on mainstream idea's or lesser ones.
>
>
I see an argument against that line of thinking.  It is true that ideas
occur in individuals, but the ideas that occur don't just pop out of a
vacuum.  There is an entire social matrix that has gone into the whole
process, thinking in terms of cultural vocabulary.

But what you (and Pirsig) refer to, imo, is "genius", which comes from the
word for beginnings, genesis, which is thus by definition, "something new".


In MoQ terms, "something new" is DQ, or from DQ or some such ineffable thing
that we can't fully understand, but what is new is only known in comparison
to what is already known - sq - the total social patterns which got you
thinking about a problem or other ideas.

So saying "ideas are produced by individuals" translates to an MoQese "ideas
are produced by individuals immersed in sq, by receptivity to DQ."

I like that, because it makes a bigger deal about "receptivity to DQ" as the
criterion for "genius" than any mere score on an intelligence test.



> Collective idea, wishfull thinking.
>
> Value of the individual.
> Economical value, showing a different picture on the economical value of a
> Lawyer, a factoryworker , or a child?
> intellectual value,an idiot versus a genious-in.. value?
>
>   An idiot can be a genius, if the idiot is open to Tao!



> a painter, artist, lets take Van Gogh, only sold about 1 painting to a
> normal client, the rest of his paintings was
> purchased by his own brother, buying them out of
> compassion,..............do i need to say more?.
>
> opposing this example against "warhol", generating millions of dollars for
> some Campbell-soup pictures?
> did warhol ever produce "art" or Beauty?nope.
>
>

I like best the art produced by my family.  If one day they became famous,
and their art valuable (economically), would that perceived added value
increase or decrease my pleasure?

Answer that question, and you've taken my version of the IQ test.



> value of the individual, not to define, ever.

Greetz , Adrie
>

Congratulations!

You passed.


John





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