[MD] Tea Bagging

[118]

Hi Andre,
As a matter of principle I do not look at Wiki, but I think I get the jist
of your post.  Yes, fascism is indeed a result of authoritarianism, some
friends of mine consider the Christian God to be fascist, and their
arguments are convincing.  Authoritarianism is often connected in this
country to the Right wing.  I do not think this is accurate as we have seen
a dramatic increase in authoritarianism under a Democrat government.   My
father was born and raised in Holland, and he sees a lot of Mussolini in
Obama, it reminds him of something he witnessed in his late teens in The
Hague.  I am strictly against any leaders and any such followers. I find
this part of human nature to be the most destructive of all.

Yes, religion is a metaphysical expression which arises through social
communication.  It is no different from that which arises from Kant or
anyone else.  Just to show you how deep in the pool I am, I also think that
science is a metaphysical expression.

Cheers,
Mark

On Fri, Oct 22, 2010 at 10:53 AM, Andre Broersen <andrebroersen at gmail.com>wrote:

> Arlo to Mark:
>
> Again, its like the woman who wanted "creationism" in school... nobody
> else's
> "creationism", mind you, just HERS. This defines Tea Baggery to the "Tea"
> (as
> it were).
>
> Arlo on Oct 21:
> "...and how long do you think it will be before another religion creeps
> into the holes they make and starts imposing itself on them?
>
> Andre:
> I have been reading some of the stuff in this thread. I do not know some of
> the players mentioned, nor
> the intricacies of the US constitution. I do however see parallels with
> what is happening here in the Netherlands and it is a bit worrying.
> Earlier I have also indicated that my experience of the US is non-existent
> (apart from news reports and hearing rationalizations of US activities
> around the globe) but that I gather that ninety-five percent of Americans
> believe in God and possibly an equal number do not believe in
> government...or rather...put up with it so long as it does not make itself
> felt. (a bit like a very good referee in a sporting match).
>
> I think that a belief in god arose out of in- and organic patterns of value
> and the belief in government arose out of social/intellectual patterns of
> value. Both are, in the MOQ, social patterns of value but as shown, their
> source is very different.
>
> God is considered an authority, Government is considered an authority.
>
> Following Arlo's experiences, god as an authority, is prized as number one.
> The vehemence, conviction and absolute sense of righteousness is worrying.
> The extremity of belief in authority to this degree reminded me of the
> research done by Adorno et.al. after WWII in an attempt to make
> understandable the atrocities, the incomprehensible cruelties and
> justifications committed by Germany which is renowned, respected and admired
> for its idealist philosophy.
>
> It is a rather long intro and I apologize. Two factors coincided:
> patriotism and the adherence and unshakable belief in an Authority ( of the
> organic/social kind) mainly found in a conservative, obedient frame of mind
> leading [inevitably?] to a logical conclusion: Fascism.
>
> Here is the link and intro:
>
> The*authoritarian personality*is an influential theory of personality
> developed byUniversity of California, Berkeley <
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_California,_Berkeley>psychologists,Else
> Frenkel-Brunswik <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Else_Frenkel-Brunswik>,Daniel
> Levinson <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Levinson>, andNevitt Sanford
> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nevitt_Sanford>and the German emigre
> sociologist and philosopherTheodor W. Adorno <
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodor_W._Adorno>, in their 1950 book of the
> same name. The personality type is defined by nine traits that were believed
> to cluster together as the result of psychodynamic, childhood experiences.
> These traits areconventionalism <
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conventionalism>, authoritarian submission,
> authoritarian aggression, anti-intraception,superstition <
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superstition>andstereotypy <
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stereotypy>,power <
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_%28philosophy%29>and "toughness,"
> destructiveness andcynicism <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cynicism>,projectivity
> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_projection>, and exaggerated
> concerns oversexuality <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_sexuality>(sexual
> repression).^[1] <
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authoritarian_personality#cite_note-0> In
> brief, the authoritarian is predisposed to follow the dictates of a strong
> leader and traditional, conventional values.
>
> The authors of/The Authoritarian Personality/, having escaped from Europe
> during WWII, became interested in the study ofanti-semitism <
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-semitism>. They advertised for
> volunteers and administered a battery of questionnaires. They selected the
> most anti-semitic and least anti-semitic of the volunteers and discarded the
> mid-group. They then contrasted the remaining two groups, coming up with
> theF-scale <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F-scale>, which measures the
> basic traits of the authoritarian personality.
>
> Recently,John Dean <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Dean>made use of the
> theory to analyze the contemporary political climate in his
> book/Conservatives without Conscience <
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatives_without_Conscience>/. The
> updated refinement of the authoritarian personality concept is the concept
> ofRight-wing authoritarianism <
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right-wing_authoritarianism>brought fourth
> byRobert Altemeyer <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Altemeyer>in 1981.
>
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