[MD] Freedom from choice

[MarshaV]

Not being an Aristotelian, it is not a matter of choosing either DQ or sq.  
For me sq is not other than DQ.  I accept both.   




On Apr 11, 2011, at 4:35 PM, X Acto wrote:

> choice
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: MarshaV <valkyr at att.net>
> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
> Sent: Mon, April 11, 2011 8:12:48 AM
> Subject: Re: [MD] Freedom from choice
> 
> 
> 
> So what is it you have?  
> 
> 
> 
> On Apr 11, 2011, at 7:58 AM, X Acto wrote:
> 
>> Marsha,
>> sounds to me like you have a whole lot of nothing.
>> -Ron
>> 
>>   
>> 
>> 
>> ----- Original Message ----
>> From: MarshaV <valkyr at att.net>
>> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
>> Sent: Mon, April 11, 2011 6:51:56 AM
>> Subject: Re: [MD] Freedom from choice
>> 
>> 
>> Ron,  
>> 
>> I have: not this, not that.  So what is it you have?    
>> 
>> 
>> Marsha
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Apr 11, 2011, at 6:24 AM, X Acto wrote:
>> 
>>> Quite right Marsha it's all we have,
>>> 
>>> 
>>> explain that to Dan
>>> 
>>> wait, no you wont because you are too afraid to disagree with him.
>>> 
>>> why is that?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ----- Original Message ----
>>> From: MarshaV <valkyr at att.net>
>>> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
>>> Sent: Mon, April 11, 2011 6:16:11 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [MD] Freedom from choice
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Ron,
>>> 
>>> And each step along the way to your "continuity" is 
>>> an act of interpretation, relative to your static history 
>>> and the dynamics of the immediate experience.  
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Marsha
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Apr 11, 2011, at 5:56 AM, X Acto wrote:
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Ron:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Dan,
>>>>> In my own opinion freedom from choice
>>>>> is like not taking any responsibility for your
>>>>> actions.
>>>> 
>>>> Dan:
>>>> I'm sorry, Ron, but this simply doesn't make sense. When we follow
>>>> static quality patterns we are without choice. That is the ultimate
>>>> accountability factor, in my opinion. We either do it or we don't
>>>> survive. So what I see you saying is: I have choices so I do not have
>>>> to take on the responsibility of doing what is better. I can do what I
>>>> want. I can drink only single malt whiskey. That is my choice.
>>>> 
>>>> Now tell me... how can a person argue with that?
>>>> 
>>>> Ron:
>>>> Again you are talking about intellectual patterns
>>>> and quotes regarding intellectual patterns and applying
>>>> it as a an arguement against what John and I are saying
>>>> within the larger context of Quality being value and linking
>>>> value to choice. I have explained the reasons why I think
>>>> this is a truer interpretation.
>>>> 
>>>> You have made the arguement for freedom from choice linked
>>>> to dynamic Quality and no choice linked to static Quality and
>>>> you do not understand why I see contradiction in that along
>>>> with squaring those concepts with the continuity of the remainder
>>>> of Pirsigs works.
>>>> 
>>>> You claim that I am not disagreeing with you but with the MoQ
>>>>   there is only one. That means there is only one way to correctly
>>>> interpret it. How else would you make this claim unless you honostly felt 
> you
>>>> possesed the interpretation?
>>>> 
>>>> Basically I think that the idea of  the MoQ pointing to freedom from choice
>>>> is the MoQ pointing to sitting on our ass and doing nothing.
>>>> 
>>>> Which is not what I get when I read Pirsig.
>>>> 
>>>> We are argueing two differing interpretations my own and your own.
>>>> I have rooted my explanation in continuity and you seem to have in 
>>> interpretive
>>>> legitimacy.
>>>> 
>>>> So with this in mind,
>>>> 
>>>> Dan:
>>>> I'm sorry, Ron, but this simply doesn't make sense. When we follow
>>>> static quality patterns we are without choice. That is the ultimate
>>>> accountability factor, in my opinion. We either do it or we don't
>>>> survive. 
>>>> 
>>>> Ron:
>>>> I guess what you dont see is that you just offered a choice as your example
>>>> "do it or don't survive" thats a choice.
>>>> 
>>>> Dan:
>>>> So what I see you saying is: I have choices so I do not have
>>>> to take on the responsibility of doing what is better. I can do what I
>>>> want. I can drink only single malt whiskey. That is my choice.
>>>> 
>>>> Ron:
>>>> No I'm saying since it is all choice, all the way down, we would do well to 
>>>> choose
>>>> in regard to the perpetuating the choices it requires to exist. I'm saying that 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> this is
>>>> the explanation of the basis of a moral reality I'm saying that existence is 
> 
>>>> nothing
>>>> but those choices and like you said, the ultimate responsibility, now,,,
>>>> How does freedom from choice figure into this context of moral responsibity?
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Dan:
>>>> Now tell me... how can a person argue with that?
> 
> 
> 
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