[MD] Fw: The Dynamics of Value

[John Carl]

Mark and Ham,

Most excellent dialogue, enjoying it a lot.  I butt in on one point where my
"ears" perked up...


> [Ham]
> > Apart from the order of existence, everything else -- the forms,
> > appearances, aesthetics, virtues, intelligence, symmetry, and meanings --
> is
> > a "value construct" of subjective sensibility.  I think it could be said
> > that the Quality of our reality is the consequence of free choice.
>
> [Mark]
> Yes, I would agree that it can be said to be a construct.  But I would
> say that such a construct is created for us, not by us.


John:

I think it could be better said, that choice and quality are functions of
each other.  For while I agree with Ham that the "Quality of our reality is
the consequence of free choice", I would also point out that the reality of
our self is a consequence of Quality.  In order for my self to be, there
must be a valued distinction from other.  We've been over this before, but I
think it bears reformulation since it seems to keep cropping up again and
again.  One idea your dialogue has inspired is this: that perhaps we feel a
psychological need to assert a dependency relation, (one thing coming before
the other) in what is actually a co-dependency, *because*  of the nature of
our own existence arising in a birth - a beginning.  We take our own reality
then, and project it "out there".  We realize our own beginning, and thus we
postulate the cosmos beginning. I think Mark has been expressing skepticism
about some definite cosmic beginning, and I agree with him.

Take care and by all means, keep going.

John