[MD] Keep on duckin'

[MarshaV]

\
Hello John,

> 
> Marsha:
> Dynamic Quality?  At which point, there is no-thing to know, and no one to
>> know it.  -  It is static quality that you know, which includes the tenant
>> of the MoQ.
>>   
>>  
> John:
> See, this is the exact part I am disputing.  Just because the self or the
> other has no independent existence, does not mean the same as it has NO
> existence.  


Marsha:
I agree.  I've never suggested that patterns have NO existence.  Patterns 
of value are processes: impermanent, interdependent, ever-changing 
processes that pragmatically tend to persist and change in a stable, 
predictable pattern.   


> John:
> I plainly have existence!  

Marsha:
Nor have I stated that the self does NOT exist.   The self is a flow of ever-changing, 
interdependent, impermanent inorganic, biological, social and intellectual static 
patterns of value.


> John:
> As I've pointed out before.  DQ being indefinable is not the same as DQ
> being "no-thing".  

Marsha:
For me DQ is non-dualistic.  DQ is indivisible, undefinable and unknowable; 
there is no-thing to know and no one to know it.  I am not saying DQ either 
exists or does not exist.  


> John:
> What it seems to me, is
> that you've fallen in thrall to intellectualism - because something can't be
> pinned down intellectually, that does not mean it's not real.  I believe
> that is the whole trap of intellectualism, which Phaedrus overcame when he
> thrashed rationality.  Perhaps you have a hard time with this idea because
> all the intellectual wranglin' that goes on around here makes it seem as if
> there's no way around intellect.  I believe this idea of yours, and Bo's for
> that matter, needs to be re-examined in the light of the dualistic nature of
> the 4th level.

Marsha:
I have never said patterns were unreal or did not exist; they are conventionally 
real.  That would be intellectual patterns, and inorganic, biological and social 
pattern conventionally exist.  


---

I am glad to hear your Mac to working properly.  The trip to NYC has been 
postponed until Thursday.  




Marsha 




 
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