[MD] The Birth of Tragedy/CH1 and the MOQ

[Arlo Bensinger]

Thanks all, glad you some found value in this line of inquiry. Thanks 
for your kind words.

Some specific responses.

[DMB]
"Nietzsche concludes that it may be possible to reattain the balance of 
Dionysian and Apollonian in modern art..."

[Arlo]
There is definitely a correlation between this thought and those in ZMM 
about rethinking "art" away from its classical dominance. I'm trying to 
read The Birth of Tragedy not just with an eye towards ZMM but LILA, 
which is why I avoiding framing Dionysian/Apollonian solely in terms of 
Romantic/Classic. But its hard to read this and not also see a lot of 
similarity to ZMM. For example, in subsequent chapters Nietzsche refers 
to an "intellectual attitude" (as Apollonian) and its hard not to map 
this directly onto "classical reason" of ZMM. But I think we can read 
Nietzche seeing his Apollonian not strictly as "classic" but as 
correlating with the fuller "intellectual level" of LILA.

I thought what I'd do is kinda move chapter by chapter and share parts 
that strike me as analogous, or at least sympathetic, to Pirsig's ideas. 
So expect more on the topic you point to soon. :-)

[Matt]
When I was assigned ZMM in Phil 101, my professor ran very successfully 
the parallel between Nietzsche's  Apollonian/Dionysian and Pirsig's 
early classic/romantic split.

[Arlo]
Yes, this A/D-C/R comparison is very strong, I've been looking around 
for others who have written juxtaposing some of Nietzsche's and Pirsig's 
ideas, but haven't found anything really fleshed out. As I mentioned 
above, I'm trying here to read BoT with an eye towards the "code of art" 
and the MOQ's intellectual level rather than solely focusing on ZMM, but 
I do freely admit that ZMM is, to me, a more important book.

[Matt]
And to tell the story really well, one might look at Nietzsche's 
Genealogy, especially, say, Book 2 sec. 17 and 18,  where _form_ is 
taken to be artist created and _violent_.

[Arlo]
Well, I wasn't planning on a full Nietzsche analogue. As I mentioned, I 
am re-reading BoT and just marking of relevant comparisons as I 
progress. I'll try to take a look at this, I certainly don't want to 
grossly misrepresent Nietzsche, and if I have the time I wouldn't mind 
going further down this path.

[Matt]
But there are significant differences between [Nietzsche, Hegel and 
Pirsig], and it would help clarify  Pirsig's position in cultural 
history to see how it was different than his predecessors.

[Arlo]
I think such a cultural-historical analysis is outside my ability. I 
haven't read much Hegel, and as I said I am by no means an expert in 
Nietzsche. But hopefully this dialogue will bring pieces of this out.

[MRB]
Interesting note: 
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/cosmicvariance/2009/02/10/nietzsche-long-live-physics/ 


[Arlo]
Also interesting, to me, is that this post starts off with Poincare. I 
definitely think there is a "cloud" of people whose work is relational 
enough to keep them juxtaposed in subsequent dialogues. An "iCloud" 
perhaps (intellectual-Cloud)... with a nod to Steve Jobs (you can't call 
Apple un-aesthetic technology).