[MD] Metaphysics

[skutvik at online.no]

Hi John

12 Jan. you said:

> The MoQ is an ideal we strive to instantiate, not an image to be
> captured in stone.  And if it ever is captured in stone, it will be
> the task of the noble iconoclast to knock it over.  Or put another way,
> if you meet Buddha on the road ... 

"Instantiate"? That one is not in my dictionary.  However, there must 
be a limit to "dynamism" and when logic *) is abolished I dig in my 
heels. If SOM is what the MOQ tries to wrestle the "M" (existence's 
innermost structure) from  and place it on its own DQ/SQ system, this 
becomes what a moqist sees as existence's innermost structure ...no?

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*) Logic is built into all computers (3 (I believe) "gates" that data must 
pass to be allowed to the next) but the computer can be programmed 
with "premises" that determine what data are to be processed. IMO 
each level - after and including biology - fed their program into the 
bilogical computer and out came the justification for their premises.

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I know that Steve will accept anything - even abolishing logic - to avoid 
the SOL, but I thought there were some who wanted to stay within the 
logcal (ordered) universe. Your reference to Buddhism for example. 
Does not a Buddhist believe that Buddhism conveys Buddhism?

>  In response, Royce proposes that the universe can be understood on the
> model of Dedekind's notion of an infinite system: that is, as any
> system that is 'similar to a constituent (or proper) part of itself'.
> Such a system 'represents itself' by its similarity to a part of
> itself, that is, it contains real relations while it is also a unified
> whole infinite system. Such a system is therefore defined by internal
> relations without self-contradiction.  And your issues with "container
> logic" disappear. 

A model indicates some bigger structure which is miniaturized so what 
goes for the model goes for the structure at a greater scale. Ergo, 
Royce's buck stops at the said "metaphysics"  ... not that I understood 
it, but that logic "disappear", no way. Pirsig uses the "container logic" 
as valid for the MOQ-SOM relationship thus people who subscribe to 
the MOQ can't abolish it when (in)convenient.   

Disappointed but still yours        

Bodvar