[MD] The difference between a Monet and a finger painting

[Ian Glendinning]

Sorry Krim, chapter 11 of what ?
Ian

On Sun, Jan 24, 2010 at 4:49 AM, Krimel <Krimel at krimel.com> wrote:
> Ian,
> Come on dude, doesn't straddling the fence all of the time make your nuts
> hurt. You know perfectly well Chapter 11 is chock full misconceptions and
> misinformation.
> Krimel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ian Glendinning [mailto:ian.glendinning at gmail.com]
> Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 6:24 AM
> To: moq_discuss at moqtalk.org
> Subject: Re: [MD] The difference between a Monet and a finger painting
>
> Krim, Ant, John,
>
> I know Ant is already dialoguing with you Krim on evolutionary
> biologists - but can I just say Dawkins and Gould are not leaders of
> the pack when it comes to understanding the "as if" teleology at play.
> I actually agree with Ant here. More enlightened evolutionary
> psychologists and cosmologists ARE taking notice of the progressive
> layered thinking inherhent in the Pirsigian model (even if Pirsig is
> not acknowledged in this, because the ideas arise independently.) The
> goal is a better understood world-view - I think Pirsig has had enough
> of celebrity.
>
> "Unfortunate" is history.
> We can also talk about "teleology" as a subject .... but must dash.
> Ian
>
> On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 8:53 PM, Krimel <Krimel at krimel.com> wrote:
>> Ant,
>> Would you agree that it is unfortunate that the MoQ excludes itself from
>> mainstream evolutionary thinking as a result of Pirsig's lack of contact
>> with say, Gould, Wilson or Dawkins? Doesn't his teleological view and his
>> insistence on a "direction" for evolution cripple progress on the MoQ?
> Would
>> you care to comment on his failure to correct his mistakes in the Baggini
>> interview?
>> Krimel
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Ant McWatt [mailto:antmcwatt at hotmail.co.uk]
>> Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2010 2:43 PM
>> To: moq discuss
>> Subject: Re: [MD] The difference between a Monet and a finger painting
>>
>>
>> Ian Glendinning stated January 19th 2010:
>>
>>> I'm reading Brian Boyd "On the Origin of Stories" at the moment, most
>>> of which so far is on the history of arts generally from a natural
>>> evolutionary perspective.
>>
>>
>> Ant McWatt says:
>>
>> Ian,
>>
>> That's an interesting reference especially with its mention of Homer's
>> "Odyssey".  For anyone else interested here is part of the publisher's
>> summary:
>>
>>
>> On the Origin of Stories
>>
>> Evolution,Cognition, and Fiction
>>
>>
>> Brian Boyd
>>
>> A century and a half after the publication of Origin of Species,
>> evolutionary
>> thinking has expanded beyond the field of biology to include virtually all
>> human-related subjects—anthropology, archeology, psychology, economics,
>> religion, morality, politics, culture, and art. Now a distinguished
> scholar
>> offers the first comprehensive account of the evolutionary origins of art
>> and
>> storytelling. Brian Boyd explains why we tell stories, how our minds are
>> shaped
>> to understand them, and what difference an evolutionary understanding of
>> human
>> nature makes to stories we love...
>>
>> After considering art as adaptation, Boyd examines Homer’s Odyssey and Dr.
>> Seuss’s
>> Horton Hears a Who! demonstrating how an evolutionary lens can offer new
>> understanding and appreciation of specific works. What triggers our
>> emotional
>> engagement with these works? What patterns facilitate our responses? The
>> need to
>> hold an audience’s attention, Boyd underscores, is the fundamental problem
>> facing
>> all storytellers. Enduring artists arrive at solutions that appeal to
>> cognitive
>> universals: an insight out of step with contemporary criticism, which
>> obscures
>> both the individual and universal.
>>
>> http://www.hup.harvard.edu/catalog/BOYORI.html
>>
>>
>>
>> .
>>
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