[MD] Intellect's Symposium

[John Carl]

And back to the issue, How is oblivious experience at all preferable or
reccomendable over awareness?

Pragmatic John

On Tue, Jan 26, 2010 at 12:21 AM, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:

>
>
>
> How about this?  I pulled a switch and instead of going through awareness,
> the train of thoughts went straight to oblivion.
>
>
>
> On Jan 26, 2010, at 3:04 AM, MarshaV wrote:
>
> >
> > John,
> >
> > I'm not a religious person and have no idea what a religious experience
> would be.
> >
> > For weeks it felt like something was going to happen, like my mind was
> squinting, or something, and then it happened.  It was visual.  I was seeing
> but their were no thoughts in my head, but I was aware.  It was seeing, but
> not seeing anything.   It lasted about 5 minutes, no less, but I don't know
> for sure.  I was flabbergasted because it was so obvious.  OMG, unpatterned
> experience!!!  Or, OMG I was totally aware without thinking.  And then I
> began not to believe my own experience, so I did on my own.  Naturally, I
> was excited.  The next day I did it again of my own volition.  I was
> overjoyed, of course.  It was wonderful.  It was amazing.  I tried it again
> about a week later, and made it happen, but I haven't tried it since, which
> is sad.  Life interfered, or more probably I'm lazy and ungrateful.  But it
> was "real".  Yet it's no big deal; it's what naturally happens.  I guess.
>  Oh, I don't know; I don't know anything.
> >
> > I do not often enough sit in meditation, but do try to keep a mindfulness
> throughout my day.  I think there is a relationship, but I'm guessing.  I
> had a very formal meditation practice for a few years and was able to watch
> my thoughts.  I have no trouble saying that's watching patterns flicker
> through mind, and that is why I go on about Quality (unpatterned experience
> and patterned experience); both have been experienced.
> >
> > Maybe you'll think I have just described indigestion.  Maybe if I hadn't
> had such experiences I'd think the same thing.
> >
> >
> > unMarsha
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Jan 25, 2010, at 7:58 PM, John Carl wrote:
> >
> >> sounds almost like a religious experience Marsha.  Did it feel that way?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, Jan 25, 2010 at 11:26 AM, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
> >>
> >>>
> >>> Hi John,
> >>>
> >>> I was teasing.  It never happened while I was formally
> >>> meditating.  I don't know why or how it happened, but
> >>> it did.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Marsha
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Jan 25, 2010, at 1:21 PM, MarshaV wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> John,
> >>>>
> >>>> Yes, the 'idea' would be a pattern, but an experience
> >>>> need not be patterned.  Instead of tenderness, try a
> >>>> little meditation.  Or, you once offered to hit me on the
> >>>> back of the head with a 2x4, may I offer to do the same
> >>>> to you.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Marsha
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Jan 25, 2010, at 1:03 PM, John Carl wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Do you mean I'd find unpatterned experience in Jane Austen?  I've
> read a
> >>>>> couple of hers, and I have no idea what would qualify.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> In fact, the very idea that anything could qualify as unpatterned, is
> a
> >>>>> pattern.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Maybe I'm just too metaphysically picky.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> John
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Mon, Jan 25, 2010 at 9:16 AM, MarshaV <valkyr at att.net> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Jan 25, 2010, at 12:04 PM, John Carl wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> There's no such thing as
> >>>>>>> "un-patterned experience"
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> John,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> There are such experiences, but not for you.   And I'm sure it
> >>>>>> is being studied as a attribute of meditation..  I bet you might
> >>>>>> find something in books by James Austin.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Marsha
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Shoot for the moon.  Even if you miss, you'll land among the
> stars...
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
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> >>>>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> >>>>
> >>>> Shoot for the moon.  Even if you miss, you'll land among the stars...
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
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> >>>
> >>> Shoot for the moon.  Even if you miss, you'll land among the stars...
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
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> > _______________________________________________________________________
> >
> > Shoot for the moon.  Even if you miss, you'll land among the stars...
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
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> _______________________________________________________________________
>
> Shoot for the moon.  Even if you miss, you'll land among the stars...
>
>
>
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