[MD] Reading & Incomprehension

[Andre Broersen]

Bodvar to Andre:

You dear fool, if it is "static" to declare the DQ/SQ ordering of reality,
then declaring a QUALITY/MOQ ordering is just as "static". Please
yourself come to your senses.

Andre:
The Tao (Quality) that can be told (MOQ) is not the eternal Tao(Quality).

Bodvar:
No new levels whatsoever. In the much harped-on "in-out-turn" SOM became the intellectual level,

Andre:
This is your argument which I do not subscribe to.I rather see the S/O division as one of many intellectual patterns of value, as a way of skillfully manipulating the symbols it creates in the process.

Bodvar:
no longer is it a somish "mind" which is needed for ideas to "reside" inside.

Andre:
'Mind' is a very confusing term and best avoided in the MOQ. Where they_are_  used they simply refer to static patterns of value, neither being fundamental.

Bodvar:
The MOQ reality is the DQ/SQ configuration. Period!

Andre:
The MOQ reality is as real as any book I happen to be reading. They are 
static representations of... a finger pointing to... . You are confusing 
the movie-critic's comments with the movie itself.

Bodvar:

Yes, I call it meta-meta  because it makes the MOQ part of a greater
system. It has bothered me since Pirsig - in a effort to be more
Buddhist than Buddha himself - began his undermining of the MOQ.

Andre:
You bring up the 'container logic' example sometimes Bodvar. If you suggest(as you do) that Quality = the MOQ then you have created a monster of a container problem. The MOQ does not have Quality, Quality has the MOQ.

Bodvar:
This is the unbearable nonsense of many "Lila's Child" annotations.
"Ideas" ...phew, the pet of the SOM instigator Plato.

Andre:
Within the MOQ ideas are intellectual patterns of value and they are just as real as inorganic patterns of value, but as mentioned before, when it come right down to it, I'd rather be hit by the former.