[MD] New Model Army, Mystic(DQ) Experience, and Religion (SQ) as Power

[Stephen Hannon]

[Ant]
Anyway, to cut to the chase, I think the issue of religion (and especially
the exploitation of Fundamentalist Christians by neo-cons) is just one of
those smokescreens often used by unscrupulous politicians to ensure their
materially comfortable lifestyle continues.  The "War on Terror" is another
myth designed to scare the US and UK population into being more submissive
and pliable for the same end.

[Steve H]
And your solution is to get rid of all religion?  I see the problem
being the vacuum of leadership at the top.  In other posts I have
shown my disgust with President Bush, I believe he and his cronies are
more of a problem than all of organized religion.  It is them who
encourage the continued ignorance of the population and feed on the
population's lust for instant gratification.

[Arlo]
And, by the way, the lyrics have nothing to do with "science" as being the only
path. I'm not even sure where you got that from.

[Steve H]
That came from DMB's post in the other thread.  I just assumed you had
posted the lyrics to seize on the anti-theistic mood in this forum
generated by the other thread.

[Arlo]
They say nothing except bowing to love and beauty is Good, while
bowing to "a god in the image of man" (a social power structure) is
not. I believe this. You find value in bowing to
such a structure. Sobeit.

[Steve H]
No.  I don't believe God is made in the image of man.  How you or New
Model Army came to that conclusion I'm not sure.  I worship God, not
the church.  The church is presently flawed and has a leadership
vacuum, much in the same way the United States is presently flawed and
has a leadership vacuum.  But you wouldn't argue for destroying the
United States, only the church because it's all the church's fault!

See, in another post you listed the 14 characteristics of fascism, and
one of them was "Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying
Cause."  I feel the MD group is attempting to identify religion as the
scapegoat and cause to all its problems.  I feel this is a dangerous
path to take.  But you find value in turning the MD group into a
fascist cult.  Sobeit.

Regards,
Steve H

On 8/2/06, Arlo J. Bensinger <ajb102 at psu.edu> wrote:
> Greetings Ant,
>
> [You wrote quoting Einstein]
> "His religious feeling takes the form of a rapturous amazement at the  harmony
> of natural law, which reveals an intelligence of such superiority  that,
> compared with it, all the systematic thinking and acting of human  beings is an
> utterly insignificant reflection."
>
> [Arlo]
> And I think the chorus of the song I mention is saying just this.
>
> "Ch: I will bow to the earth, bow to the sea,
> Bow to the love between you and me,
> Bow to the sun, bow to the land
> But never to a god made in the image of man"
>
> I've also found parallel in another New Model Army song to Pirsig. In "I Love
> the World", they write...
>
> "These cities are illusions of some triumph over Nature's laws
> We've seen the iron carcass rust and buildings topple into dust
> And as the waters rise, it seems we cling to all the rootless things
> The Christian lies, technology, while spirits scream and sing
> Oh God I love the world."
>
> This is expressed nearly exactly in ZMM.
>
>
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