[MD] Social Imposition ?

[David M]

Hi

Is there a question here about what can be a source of DQ?
I understand individuals can be a source of DQ, so do collectives
only preserve & accumulate SQ?

David M

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Case" <Case at iSpots.com>
To: <moq_discuss at moqtalk.org>
Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 4:34 AM
Subject: Re: [MD] Social Imposition ?


>> [Platt]
>> In short, evolution occurs through a process of "Dynamic invention,"
>> not some magical "emergence" from increasing collectivization.
>>
>> [Case]
>> As long people were confined to talking amongst themselves and repeating
>> tales around the campfire culture remained in a relatively primitive
> state.
>> Culture really only became a significant force with the advent of 
>> writing.
>
> [Platt]
> The "advent of writing" -- like magical emergence? Or a Dynamic invention 
> by
> a human individual, like Gutenberg Dynamically invented printing with
> movable type.
>
> [Case]
> Guttenberg represents the next great exponential shift in this process. 
> But
> writing itself was not invented by any one person. It developed over
> thousands of years. Cave painting from 30,000 years. Summerian, Babylonian
> and Egyptian go back 5,000 years. The oldest Chinese is around 3,500 years
> old. There were markings on bones carried by the 7000 year old ice man dug
> up a while back. So if you want to pick an "inventor" it will have to a be
> multicultural party.
>
> But here it is the invention itself and its cultural impact that are
> important not the Who was on first thingy.
>
>> [Case]
>> But more to the point "Dynamic invention"; "magical emergence"? You say
>> potato I say potatoe. Evolution is about how systems maintain equilibrium
>> in the face of change. The extension of individual human memory in the
>> form of written language is a change that originated not in the
>> environment but in within the species. It is an example of an 
>> intellectual
>> pattern causing disequilibrium at the social level. As Prigione indicates
>> when a system is pushed into a far from equilibrium state in can either
>> reorganize into a higher state of energy or a lower one. In this instance
>> it was a higher one and the results are... well History.
>
> [Platt]
> Your description of evolution and Pirsig's are at odds. I'll go with
> Pirsig's.
>
> [Case]
> And in what specific way do you think my account is at odds with Pirsig's?
>
>
>
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